Topic: Used Vehicle Review: Lexus LS, 2007-2015

[Triple Bob]

Check your oil when you top up with gas... like people use to do?

Yeah, and then crank it by hand! 

My monocle fell off and almost got twisted up in the crank handle once....I was so mad I threw my fedora 

yOu mean you had your servant throw your fedora

I think the only people that still check their oil when filling up is RX-8 owners.

[rrocket]

PM Patrick  Maybe he can reveal inside Hyundai Info, maybe he can't.

He couldn't provide me much info when I contacted him about the Genny sedan long term reliability.  Although to be fair...that's not his wheelhouse.

[rrocket]

i wouldn't necessarily say that..

Then you're in denial or haven't been in competing cars then.  Corners were cut big time...but for me, most evident corner cutting occurred in the interior.

[Ex-airbalancer]

Check your oil when you top up with gas... like people use to do?

Yeah, and then crank it by hand! 

My monocle fell off and almost got twisted up in the crank handle once....I was so mad I threw my fedora 

yOu mean you had your servant throw your fedora

I think the only people that still check their oil when filling up is RX-8 owners.

I thought RX-8 owners filled up will oil and check the gas ?

[Triple Bob]

Check your oil when you top up with gas... like people use to do?

Yeah, and then crank it by hand! 

My monocle fell off and almost got twisted up in the crank handle once....I was so mad I threw my fedora 

yOu mean you had your servant throw your fedora

I think the only people that still check their oil when filling up is RX-8 owners.

I thought RX-8 owners filled up will oil and check the gas ?

True.

[dirtyjeffer]

i wouldn't necessarily say that..

Then you're in denial or haven't been in competing cars then.  Corners were cut big time...but for me, most evident corner cutting occurred in the interior.

hold on here though...the Genesis was never designed to compete with the LS...the LS is $100k+ car, the Genesis, at most is just over $60k...it would by far more appropriate to compare the Genesis against its direct competitors than the flagship sedan of a brand (that costs twice as much)...for example, how does a $48k Genesis compete against a $48k ES350, A6, or C350 (throw in a Caddy, Infiniti, etc)?

saying that "corners were cut" when comparing it to an an LS is rather disingenuous.

[rrocket]

i wouldn't necessarily say that..

Then you're in denial or haven't been in competing cars then.  Corners were cut big time...but for me, most evident corner cutting occurred in the interior.

hold on here though...the Genesis was never designed to compete with the LS...the LS is $100k+ car, the Genesis, at most is just over $60k...it would by far more appropriate to compare the Genesis against its direct competitors than the flagship sedan of a brand (that costs twice as much)...for example, how does a $48k Genesis compete against a $48k ES350, A6, or C350 (throw in a Caddy, Infiniti, etc)?

saying that "corners were cut" when comparing it to an an LS is rather disingenuous.

Compare it to large sedans in it's class....GS430, BMW 5 Series, Infiniti M45, etc.

The Genesis interior feels decidedly cheap compared to those too.

[mixmanmash]

i wouldn't necessarily say that..

Then you're in denial or haven't been in competing cars then.  Corners were cut big time...but for me, most evident corner cutting occurred in the interior.

hold on here though...the Genesis was never designed to compete with the LS...the LS is $100k+ car, the Genesis, at most is just over $60k...it would by far more appropriate to compare the Genesis against its direct competitors than the flagship sedan of a brand (that costs twice as much)...for example, how does a $48k Genesis compete against a $48k ES350, A6, or C350 (throw in a Caddy, Infiniti, etc)?

saying that "corners were cut" when comparing it to an an LS is rather disingenuous.

Compare it to large sedans in it's class....GS430, BMW 5 Series, Infiniti M45, etc.

The Genesis interior feels decidedly cheap compared to those too.

Agreed.  And I have sat in a Genesis, Equus along with the Lexus GS, BMW 5 Series, Audi A6, Infiniti M, Mercedes Benz E-Class, etc.

Don't get me wrong.  The Genesis for the price point wasn't bad, but definitely not quite up to par.

[2JDM]

My buddy has a 2013 R-Spec Genesis V8. He bought it last year for about $30k with 45 km.

Its a BEAST and pulls like crazy! He says it burns oil though, 1.5 quarts in 4 months... 

Yeah - I've read about the oil consumption issue - want to dig into that a bit more.

hmmm...the oil consumption issue is concerning...it shouldn't be burning oil (or leaking it either, of course).

1.5 quart in 4 months?  how many km run in that time?  that seems high.  my bimmer burns about 500 cc in 10,000 km.

1.5 quarts within 4000 km of driving in 4 months.

He literally drives it a few km each day to the GO Train station and back.

[dirtyjeffer]

Compare it to large sedans in it's class....GS430, BMW 5 Series, Infiniti M45, etc.

The Genesis interior feels decidedly cheap compared to those too.

i've read otherwise about the current generation, but whatever.

the GS430 is quite a bit more than the Genesis (Rspec excluded)...a GS430 starts at $56,550 which is $12,550 more than the Genesis starting point...even if you choose the Technology Package on the Genesis, it tops out at $53,000...adding the Executive Package to the GS to keep them comparably equipped jumps the GS price to $69,950, or a whopping $16,950 more than the Genesis.

a 5 series with a 6 cylinder engine starts at $67,000...add in the Premium Package to get it well equipped and you're at $72,500, a difference of $19,500...and it certainly won't have the reliability of the Lexus.

the Infiniti is likely the closest competitor price wise, as their large sedan is now called the Q70, and if you pick the Sport model to get it fully loaded is $63,200...that's still $10,200 more than the Genesis with Tech Package.

from most reviews i've seen, the Genesis holds its own out there...nothing against the Lexus (or other brands), but more of a kudos to the Genesis...it's a pretty decent car and really deserves more credit than many give it.

[Jaeger]

Also for every one complaining on the internet probably 1000 who have no issues. ?

No question that is true. But when you explore brand forums you get some reasonable feedback for what is a prevalent problem versus the general mix of glitches and assorted stuff that has gone wrong. The number of people reporting not slight but significant oil consumption, as representative of the forum population. Of 2012 R-spec owners, is hard to ignore.  More than a handful had engine blocks replaced. That is not the kind of out of warranty expense I'd like to incur.

I haven't bailed on the idea, just need to get some sense of how I can satisfy myself that this car is free of that problem. If you're not changing or checking your oil yourself, you might never notice - assuming you didn't actually damn near run dry.

Anyway - the RSpec rally appeals. In part because it is quite affordable and huge bang for the buck.

Came across an even.more cherry LS - 70k on a 2011 - and I gotta say that extra 50k km is VERY appealing to me over the previous top LS candidate.  But asking price starts to exceed my ability to rationalize used (it was 37 or 38). Given that it wouldn't be a full cash purchase, the difference in financing used versus new is significant. Is a 5 year old LS a better buy than a brand new Genesis (V6) when 0% brings them closer in price than one might initially think?

Anyway, I think I may be testing the patience of my fellow forum members with all the back and forth. But buying used is a whole bunch more complicated than buying new.

I'll take a break from the shopping and just see what I can figure out on the RSpec. I've pretty much driven everything I am likely to consider buying. If I don't  go for that I will ponder the relative merits of a 5 year old Lexus versus brand new Genesis, because it would be down to those two to duke it out as they are my clear faves n the new and used segments.

[Jaeger]

I would not say the interior of the new Genesis gives anything away to the current GS. I don't think I've been in current 5 series. It's nicer inside than the Q50, IMO, against which it is more price - competitive than with the Q's big brother.

[johngenx]

These threads never test anyone's patience other than rrrrrrron. It's the whole point of the forum.  :-)

I'd rather a used Lexus than a new Genesis. But I love used cars as they've already had a bunch of depreciation lopped off and I'm cheap.

I also keep my cars until 400K or more. Toyota products give the best odds of going that distance.


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[rrocket]

the GS430 is quite a bit more than the Genesis (Rspec excluded)...

Why are you excluding the R-Spec?  The R-Spec matches most closely a V8 GS430 and M45.

Or is this your Hyundai fan-boy defense kicking into high gear?   

[dirtyjeffer]

Agreed.  And I have sat in a Genesis, Equus along with the Lexus GS, BMW 5 Series, Audi A6, Infiniti M, Mercedes Benz E-Class, etc.

Don't get me wrong.  The Genesis for the price point wasn't bad, but definitely not quite up to par.

James thinks the Genesis holds its own just fine:

http://www.autos.ca/car-test-drives/day-by-day-review-2015-hyundai-genesis/1/

and Justin's review of the 5.0 Ultimate was favourable as well:

http://www.autos.ca/car-test-drives/test-drive-2015-hyundai-genesis-5-0-ultimate/?all=1

and Car and Driver too:

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2015-hyundai-genesis-v-6-awd-test-review

[rrocket]

Anyway, I think I may be testing the patience of my fellow forum members with all the back and forth.

If it helps, I never tire of this stuff.  Even AFTER I've bought a car I still "shop" for cars almost every day....

[Jaeger]

Jaeger, I did a quick search and found this tidbit:

From what Imhave learned, the oil consumption problem was caused by the use of some German made low friction piston rings that would not properly seat thereby allowing for oil blow by and the resultant consumption. Hyundai was only one of several manufactures that used these defective rings.

It appears that Hyundai figured this out and any vehicles with build dates after Feb. or March of 2012, possibly earlier, have good rings in them with no consumption problems.

So, if you have the VIN you can figure out the build date.

By the way, my uninformed take is that the Lexus is the showcase for a brand whose mission it is to build the highest quality cars possible.   As such it is impeccably built and will go the long haul.

The Hyundai is good car that was built to be a cheaper 5 series and just happens to have a strong motor. As such corners were cut to meet a price point and it will nickel and dime you as it ages.

Thanks for the info on the build date - that's helpful.

There's no question the LS is the better vehicle and my straight up fave. But the RSpec was more of a hoot to drive and considerably less money. Apples and bananas, I freely admit.

I put the question to myself, of get the RSpec and then see an LS rolling up beside me, do I feel any regret? What about the reverse, when the guy in the RSpec walks on me? This s÷¡t camare me lose sleep.

[Hannibalsmith]

Anyway, I think I may be testing the patience of my fellow forum members with all the back and forth.

If it helps, I never tire of this stuff.  Even AFTER I've bought a car I still "shop" for cars almost every day....

I thought everyone does that?

[rrocket]

I put the question to myself, of get the RSpec and then see an LS rolling up beside me, do I feel any regret? What about the reverse, when the guy in the RSpec walks on me? This s÷¡t camare me lose sleep.

I never feel like I'm driving the inferior vehicle when I'm in my LS....unless something REEEAALLLY nice rolls up beside me.  Which hasn't happened yet.

[rrocket]

Anyway, I think I may be testing the patience of my fellow forum members with all the back and forth.

If it helps, I never tire of this stuff.  Even AFTER I've bought a car I still "shop" for cars almost every day....

I thought everyone does that?

Only those of use with the disease, man.