Topic: Honda mulls new S2000, BMW i8 to go topless, and Mazda takes aim at Outback

[OliverD]

I think you're jumping to conclusions. The Mazda concept's roofline is nowhere near as aggressive as the X4's:

*Oliver's attack-No-san's sense is tingling*

"Did No-san say something? Must. Refute. His. Claims!!"

I only refute the ridiculous things people say. You just say more of those than most.

I'd argue it's closer to the RX...

Either way, Mazda still doesn't quite get why folks like the Outback - it's down to the large cargo hold, decent rear-seat legroom, and Subaru's reputation for AWD awesomesauce.

Well I don't think Mazda is exactly targeting the Outback specifically - the Automotive News article just says "that kind of genre".

But it's interesting that with all of its success no one has made an Outback clone for our market yet. The closest would be various Audis and Volvos but those are obviously a rung or two upmarket. Toyota was probably closest with the Venza. Honda had a good opportunity with the Crosstour but they screwed that one up. The Golf Alltrak will be the first legit Outback competitor. It only took 22 years. 

[Noto]

Well I don't think Mazda is exactly targeting the Outback specifically - the Automotive News article just says "that kind of genre".

Well, why didn't you say that before? 

[johngenx]

The Miata is a "halo" car that shows off their engineering and car-enthusiast spirit.  It doesn't have to be a half million dollar car to bring attention to the brand regardless of sales volumes - the Miata has been playing that role for Mazda for a long, long time.  They let people know that they "get it."

What does Honda have on it's floor that gets car nuts excited?  The Si?  I suppose, but it's still a FWD car that is far from the stripped down RWD lightweight that the Miata is.  Right now Honda cares a lot more about CR-Vs than anything with RWD or a manual trans.  It's all about business.  Glad Soichiro isn't around to see what the current product line is.  He sold normal cars to make money to build other really cool stuff like outrageous motorcycles and neato cars.

[mixmanmash]

Glad Soichiro isn't around to see what the current product line is.  He sold normal cars to make money to build other really cool stuff like outrageous motorcycles and neato cars.

This.  I love my Odyssey and all, but it is not a halo model.  They need a S2000 or something.  Sure, Acura will get the NSX, but Honda needs something exciting.  The Civic Type-R will help, but something akin to the S2000 would be perfect.

[evil_twin]

But it's interesting that with all of its success no one has made an Outback clone for our market yet. The closest would be various Audis and Volvos but those are obviously a rung or two upmarket. Toyota was probably closest with the Venza. Honda had a good opportunity with the Crosstour but they screwed that one up. The Golf Alltrak will be the first legit Outback competitor. It only took 22 years. 

But since the 2009 model year is the Outback really anything other than a CUV with a nice AWD system?   The older ones was more of that unique wagon-esque utility vehicle.  Like the XC70 and audi allroad.  What differentiates the current Outback from the horde of CUVs other than Subaru AWD?

[Sir Osis of Liver]

But it's interesting that with all of its success no one has made an Outback clone for our market yet. The closest would be various Audis and Volvos but those are obviously a rung or two upmarket. Toyota was probably closest with the Venza. Honda had a good opportunity with the Crosstour but they screwed that one up. The Golf Alltrak will be the first legit Outback competitor. It only took 22 years. 

But since the 2009 model year is the Outback really anything other than a CUV with a nice AWD system?   The older ones was more of that unique wagon-esque utility vehicle.  Like the XC70 and audi allroad.  What differentiates the current Outback from the horde of CUVs other than Subaru AWD?

One thing that I appreciated about the 2011 3.6R we had was the plush ride.

But you're correct. Our 2008 was much more a wagon than our 2011 was.

[Noto]

What differentiates the current Outback from the horde of CUVs other than Subaru AWD?

One thing that I appreciated about the 2011 3.6R we had was the plush ride.

That's HILARIOUS.  Before I read SirO's post, I was going to write "the plush ride."

...then I read on.  We think in similar ways, you and I, SirO

Mazda's zoom-zoom doesn't fly with the masses in the way Mazda would have liked.  Corolla/Camrys of yesteryear did.  Why?  Cheap.  Plush.  Utilitarian.

[Sir Osis of Liver]

 

The other CUVs at the time were pretty bouncy if not downright harsh. The Outback was a much better family ride.

[johngenx]

Overall, the OBW has always been one of the softest riding Subaru products.

[mnztr]

That i8 is stunning...

[SKYMTL]

Either way, Mazda still doesn't quite get why folks like the Outback - it's down to the large cargo hold, decent rear-seat legroom, and Subaru's reputation for AWD awesomesauce.

Add to that a decent amount of outwards visibility....something current Mazdas completely lack. 

[Solstice2006]

Either way, Mazda still doesn't quite get why folks like the Outback - it's down to the large cargo hold, decent rear-seat legroom, and Subaru's reputation for AWD awesomesauce.

Add to that a decent amount of outwards visibility....something current Mazdas completely lack.

Makes no sense to say completely lack.  That would mean you couldn't see at all.  I do just fine with my Mazda6, with tints.  No nannies either, mirrors and shoulder check.  Do Subarus have better outward visibility?  Yes.  But the trend nowadays is to have the sloped back.  The new Civic, many Kia's, some Audi's.