Author Topic: Tesla Model X revealed  (Read 23123 times)

Offline rrocket

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #20 on: September 30, 2015, 08:30:06 pm »
I've seen so many articles today talking about its stunning looks. I just don't get it. It looks so ridiculously proportioned and awkward. Almost like a smoothed out pontiac aztek.

Wow..does it have to be so ugly?

And I'm not sure about those rear doors...

I know.  The Model S is a nice looking car..handsome.

This is not.
How fast is my 911?  Supras sh*t on on me all the time...in reverse..with blown turbos  :( ...

Offline mixmanmash

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #21 on: September 30, 2015, 11:05:37 pm »
The signal-to-noise ratio of this site's discussions continues to be disappointingly low.
And yet you're still here...

Offline Cord

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #22 on: September 30, 2015, 11:47:04 pm »
I've seen so many articles today talking about its stunning looks. I just don't get it. It looks so ridiculously proportioned and awkward. Almost like a smoothed out pontiac aztek.

Wow..does it have to be so ugly?

And I'm not sure about those rear doors...

Agreed. Those doors are just dumb. And the whole thing is surprisingly homely. Maybe the gorgeous looking Model S design was a fluke?
"If we can just believe something then we don't have to really think for ourselves, do we?" Paul Haggis

Offline Danno001

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #23 on: October 01, 2015, 07:55:55 am »
An interesting discussion on a business site revolved around the model x's impact on sales.  The conclusion was that this model won't be much of a contributor for 2 reasons.  It's price and the fact that it will probably cannibalize sales of the model s.  The analyst basically said the only way tesla will start making money is if they can drop the manufacturing price enough to mass produce the model 3 which is at least 2 years off.  Everybody is talking about this new gagafactory is going to be the answer to everything but I don't see it.  But then again the Bmw i3 is mid 40s but it's battery is much smaller than the one being proposed for the model 3.

I agree with with your comments except we have enough (Lady) gaga's .

They are building a "gigafactory".

 ;D

Offline bluelines

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #24 on: October 01, 2015, 08:27:38 am »
I think I'm in the minority, but I don't even think the Model S is particularly stunning. It's sleek and inoffensive, but looks like it was designed mostly to be acceptable to the broadest mix of buyers. The result is a pretty bland design. All the talk of the fantastic interior is strange, too. The touchscreen is impressive, but the rest is a mix of materials and design that just aren't competitive with other $100k+ vehicles.

I've seen so many articles today talking about its stunning looks. I just don't get it. It looks so ridiculously proportioned and awkward. Almost like a smoothed out pontiac aztek.

Wow..does it have to be so ugly?

And I'm not sure about those rear doors...

Agreed. Those doors are just dumb. And the whole thing is surprisingly homely. Maybe the gorgeous looking Model S design was a fluke?

Offline Triple Bob

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #25 on: October 01, 2015, 09:05:03 am »
I like it. 


Choosing a car based on reliability is like choosing a wife based solely because she is punctual. There is more to it than that...

Offline Danno001

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #26 on: October 01, 2015, 09:09:27 am »
I've seen so many articles today talking about its stunning looks. I just don't get it. It looks so ridiculously proportioned and awkward. Almost like a smoothed out pontiac aztek.

Wow..does it have to be so ugly?

And I'm not sure about those rear doors...

The doors are a gimmick to say hey look at me when they are used at the Whole Foods parking lot.
 
Justifies the 120K USD or $160K CDN price tag I guess ....



Agreed. Those doors are just dumb. And the whole thing is surprisingly homely. Maybe the gorgeous looking Model S design was a fluke?

Offline Silverbird

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #27 on: October 01, 2015, 10:03:55 am »
Coupla things:

Don't forget that the prices in the article are the fully loaded, full speed spec.  In the Mercedes range, that's a GL 63 AMG for $128K CAD.   Once production gets up to speed in the next few months, The Model X 70 will be available, bringing the price down similar to the bottom end GL 450 at $80k.

This was never supposed to be affordable, It's in the same bracket as the Model S, playing in the same (rough) price league as the S Class or 7 series

Really the problem in Canada is that they haven't had any hedging, so the CAD prices of everything Tesla is close to the actual F/X rate  ~1.3 times higher.

I agree about the comments about the shape - not a fan, I really hope that was a concession to get the lowest possible Cd - function over form.  And white is not helping with the egg comparison.

As someone who thinks a little longer term, all of the "cool advances" on this SUV make me shudder with the complexity involved - ie the falcon wing doors - I would have to think that if one sensor dies, the whole thing deactivates, and it can't be that fun in the winter with snow blowing in while it slowly opens and closes
-The second row seats, motorized to move them forward and back - if that dies, it's not easy to get to the back seat.
-The pano windshield.  Would not like to think about replacement cost after a rock hit, plus it's so large it is a bigger target for more rocks - I  have a number of rock dings and missing paint in the leading edge of my roof, right above the windshield (that reminds me, I need to get on that)

I agree with others, they really need to be careful of this cannibalizing Model S sales, although if they are producing at capacity, it's always better to be selling the higher margin SUV instead of a sedan.

Like others, I really want to see the Model 3 reveal in March and see what they have in mind.  I would look very closely at that as a future car, when it comes out in a few years.



Offline Guy

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #28 on: October 01, 2015, 10:06:09 am »
An interesting discussion on a business site revolved around the model x's impact on sales.  The conclusion was that this model won't be much of a contributor for 2 reasons.  It's price and the fact that it will probably cannibalize sales of the model s.  The analyst basically said the only way tesla will start making money is if they can drop the manufacturing price enough to mass produce the model 3 which is at least 2 years off.  Everybody is talking about this new gagafactory is going to be the answer to everything but I don't see it.  But then again the Bmw i3 is mid 40s but it's battery is much smaller than the one being proposed for the model 3.

I agree with with your comments except we have enough (Lady) gaga's .

They are building a "gigafactory".

 ;D

haha! imagine a gagafactory pumping lady gagas??   EEEEEEEEEW.  i was typing on my phone while driving on a sidewalk.

now there's talk that the i5, which will be the size of a 3series or a little larger, will be a fuel cell battery hybrid car.  i'd be seriously tempted if one of these companies can make a car the size of a 3 series wagon with the range close to the model S around the 60k mark.   

Where will you fuel it??

Offline Guy

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #29 on: October 01, 2015, 10:07:49 am »
Interesting how its all about 0-60 times vs. saving the planet now  :P

Who said being green had to be boring?  ;D

Is it really green  :) there is no such thing.

Well greener than the TDI's for sure.. Even VAG agrees.. :rofl2:

http://www.theautonet.com/en/2015/09/30/volkswagen-and-audi-give-back-awards

Offline Sir Osis of Liver

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #30 on: October 01, 2015, 10:13:09 am »

I agree about the comments about the shape - not a fan, I really hope that was a concession to get the lowest possible Cd - function over form.  And white is not helping with the egg comparison.


They are claiming a Cd of 0.24, which is as low as I've ever heard of for a CUV.
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Offline Noto

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #31 on: October 01, 2015, 10:31:12 am »
Interesting how its all about 0-60 times
I sort of agree - while I think the whole "P" and "D" range of Teslas are fun in respect of outright powah, I'd be perfectly happy (in fact, I'd prefer!) if I could get a Tesla Model X 90R (range?  regular?  reasonable?) for $110,000 with the same 90 kWh battery, but range up to 600km and 0-60 time down to the mid 5-6 seconds.  That'd still be hella fast, and the range would be better appreciated IMO.  Now, I don't know what the effect would be of decreasing the power - would a 5-6 second 90kWh Model X be 600km instead of 413?  Or would it be closer to 425km?  If increasing the power output only affects range by a few percentage points, it's likely worth the tradeoff to make it unreasonably fast.

...still - imagine even a 500km Model X that's as fast as a X5 M.  Nobody would complain about the loss of "ludicrous mode" - especially if it remains an option at the expense of range (i.e. those who would complain could just shell out the extra $ to get the 3.2s version).

What happens if you're upside down with these gull doors?  Can you get out?
:iagree: ; however, given the low CG and highly improbable chance of flipping (and then the more improbable chance of landing on the roof), I'm guessing it was a calculated choice.  Even I, who am very concerned about car safety, would not really find the doors' operation in a rollover to be a concern.  With all that glass, just crawl out through the front :P

Quote
The odd-looking egg-shaped...
...the Model X can tow up to 2,000 kg – this is huge but I wonder at what cost to the overall range of the EV.
...I can’t wait to see how they manage to fit a canoe rack on those falcon doors.
I also thought it looked like an egg :)
...but also, thought it looked an awful lot like:



That it can tow is huge, and I'm sure the range (on the highway especially) will drop more like to 150-200km.  With that being said, the Supercharger network is growing...

I wouldn't expect any roof rack accessories to be made at any point - canoes can be brought along thusly:


My collective thoughts on the Model X are these:
I think the design is on the bland side, but no more or less offensive than the typical German offering.  It is, for sure, less 'interesting' than the Nissan Murano or Lexus RX - take that as you will.  The design features of the dual trunk makes this thing very useful in terms of being a 7-seater, especially since no Thule box will be used - while Thule boxes are useful, they're also a pain to install/remove, and they suck w.r.t. drag and even reaching into them/pulling things out.  While a trailer isn't MUCH better, it does make more sense for those who occasionally need more space.  The ski rack on the back is a great feature that makes this thing relatively ideal for heading out to the (Blue) mountains ;D.

I maintain that trying to make this thing super fast over having a SUPER long range is a way of distinguishing an already distinguished vehicle, and a method to try to get high end sales first.  Eventually, a more plebeian Model X will rear its egg-like head(/body) and will be one helluva contender if the price can drop to even $70k for a 500+km, 6-second 7-seater CUV.

Eliminating at least $2,000/year in gas costs (and then there's maintenance...etc), while adding in the potential for free supercharging, or cheaper electricity, will certainly be a long-term draw. 

The Model X will not be for everyone, but for the mall-going public, I cannot envision a better offering.  Good job, Tesla, and especially w.r.t. the tall glass and immense outward visibility despite all the driver's aids.

Insofar as the Egg profile is considered a "bad" thing, I grew up in an "egg" (and it was the first carvan I ever drove) - a 1992 Toyota Previa LE.  Mind you, that was a mid-engined, RWD minivan...still awesome.  It's endearing to families, and certainly having a .cd of 0.24 is incredible - nearly on par with the currently amazing Audi A4 (0.23).  Hell, the Prius is at 0.25 (until the new one comes out - and if you think that thing looks any better than this...well...).

Offline Guy

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #32 on: October 01, 2015, 10:35:42 am »
Well they seem to have issues in California.

http://venturebeat.com/2015/07/25/california-fuel-cell-car-drivers-say-hydrogen-fuel-unavailable-stations-dont-work-updated/

http://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2015/08/20/hydrogen-fuel-cell-car-draws-attention-excitement-but-lack-of-fueling-stations-a-worry/

And you know about the Whistler BC fuel cell buses, decommissioned after a couple of years of service. The hydrogen was trucked in from Quebec.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/bc-transit-s-90m-hydrogen-bus-fleet-to-be-sold-off-converted-to-diesel-1.2861060

The only appeal of the Fuel cell car is that I maintain the current paradigm of car driving, ie you have a 500 km or so of range and you can fuel it in 5-10 minutes and resume driving. It also maintain another paradigm.. The hydrogen will be distributed by the same petro companies which have taken advantage of us for many years.


Offline Danno001

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #33 on: October 01, 2015, 12:51:10 pm »
The hydrogen will be distributed by the same petro companies which have taken advantage of us for many years.
O/T - Great point. Case in point.
Fuel supply companies (Shell) have been pushing LNG/CG Natural Gas as a fuel for Class 8 tractors. But then they go and peg it to the price of crude/other petro bechmark. As well, road taxes on NG are a wild card - no government is committing to anything.
Add lack of engine suitable for loads over 80,000 lbs and lack of fueling infrastructure.
No need to wonder why road use NG is a clusterfarck in Canada.

Offline Ex-airbalancer

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #34 on: October 01, 2015, 01:34:53 pm »
Well they seem to have issues in California.

http://venturebeat.com/2015/07/25/california-fuel-cell-car-drivers-say-hydrogen-fuel-unavailable-stations-dont-work-updated/

http://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2015/08/20/hydrogen-fuel-cell-car-draws-attention-excitement-but-lack-of-fueling-stations-a-worry/

And you know about the Whistler BC fuel cell buses, decommissioned after a couple of years of service. The hydrogen was trucked in from Quebec.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/bc-transit-s-90m-hydrogen-bus-fleet-to-be-sold-off-converted-to-diesel-1.2861060

The only appeal of the Fuel cell car is that I maintain the current paradigm of car driving, ie you have a 500 km or so of range and you can fuel it in 5-10 minutes and resume driving. It also maintain another paradigm.. The hydrogen will be distributed by the same petro companies which have taken advantage of us for many years.
Are the gas companies any worst then Hyrdo One ? Probably not  ::)  :rofl2:

Offline Guy

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #35 on: October 01, 2015, 04:48:44 pm »
Well they seem to have issues in California.

http://venturebeat.com/2015/07/25/california-fuel-cell-car-drivers-say-hydrogen-fuel-unavailable-stations-dont-work-updated/

http://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2015/08/20/hydrogen-fuel-cell-car-draws-attention-excitement-but-lack-of-fueling-stations-a-worry/

And you know about the Whistler BC fuel cell buses, decommissioned after a couple of years of service. The hydrogen was trucked in from Quebec.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/bc-transit-s-90m-hydrogen-bus-fleet-to-be-sold-off-converted-to-diesel-1.2861060

The only appeal of the Fuel cell car is that I maintain the current paradigm of car driving, ie you have a 500 km or so of range and you can fuel it in 5-10 minutes and resume driving. It also maintain another paradigm.. The hydrogen will be distributed by the same petro companies which have taken advantage of us for many years.
Are the gas companies any worst then Hyrdo One ? Probably not  ::)  :rofl2:

I don't know, but Hydro Québec seem just fine. My annual electricity bill went up $200. for the year I have had the Leaf. Factor in Québec had a record cold winter (My house uses electric heating) and the 1.2% price increase, I'm not sure if my car cost me anything to run 20,000 km last year.. :rofl2:

Offline CAS

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #36 on: October 01, 2015, 05:09:30 pm »
I wonder about the environmental impact for manufacturing and disposing of the batteries.

Offline Sir Osis of Liver

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #37 on: October 01, 2015, 05:16:23 pm »
I wonder about the environmental impact for manufacturing and disposing of the batteries.

Why dispose of the batteries? They can be recycled.

Offline Triple Bob

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #38 on: October 01, 2015, 05:16:51 pm »
I wonder about the environmental impact for manufacturing and disposing of the batteries.

Please don't bring facts into the debate...

 ;)

Offline Ex-airbalancer

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Re: Tesla Model X revealed
« Reply #39 on: October 01, 2015, 05:17:19 pm »
Well they seem to have issues in California.

http://venturebeat.com/2015/07/25/california-fuel-cell-car-drivers-say-hydrogen-fuel-unavailable-stations-dont-work-updated/

http://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2015/08/20/hydrogen-fuel-cell-car-draws-attention-excitement-but-lack-of-fueling-stations-a-worry/

And you know about the Whistler BC fuel cell buses, decommissioned after a couple of years of service. The hydrogen was trucked in from Quebec.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/bc-transit-s-90m-hydrogen-bus-fleet-to-be-sold-off-converted-to-diesel-1.2861060

The only appeal of the Fuel cell car is that I maintain the current paradigm of car driving, ie you have a 500 km or so of range and you can fuel it in 5-10 minutes and resume driving. It also maintain another paradigm.. The hydrogen will be distributed by the same petro companies which have taken advantage of us for many years.
Are the gas companies any worst then Hyrdo One ? Probably not  ::)  :rofl2:

I don't know, but Hydro Québec seem just fine. My annual electricity bill went up $200. for the year I have had the Leaf. Factor in Québec had a record cold winter (My house uses electric heating) and the 1.2% price increase, I'm not sure if my car cost me anything to run 20,000 km last year.. :rofl2:
When is the lease up on Churchhill River2041 I wonder what will happen to your rates ? It will probably be as bad as Ontario lol
« Last Edit: October 02, 2015, 06:08:05 am by Airbalancer »