Topic: First Drive: 2016 Ford Explorer Platinum

[mixmanmash]

Sounds like a very good SUV indeed.  I'm glad that a ecoboosted Ford finally impressed with it's fuel efficiency.  Anyone else see a lot of Land Rover in that front grill?

I won't complain about the price as it seems this vehicle has all the luxury you would expect from something this price.  I wonder if employee pricing would knock the price down another $4,000+.

If it was my money, I'd definitely choose this over the Navigator.  Much better looking, same engine, plus all the luxury.

A Navigator is much larger than the Explorer IMO.  Hardly a comparison.

[mixmanmash]

Now THIS was a fine piece of writing.  It certainly does set the stage for one to really like the sound of the Explorer, and at $59k (give or take some incentive $), it makes even the MDX a pricey beast.

I would ask why taz would care where the fuse panel is, but the answer is that he either is a tinkering guy, or that he has had issues with fuses or other electrical gremlins in his.

The Explorer remains compelling when viewed in the wake of Tom's article.

The answer for the fuse box is that when the MFT froze at times - and it wouldn't come back unless the fuse was pulled or the battery disconnected. When I tried to get into the damned fuse box, it was impossible to get to the fuse. Imagine that you blow a fuse and try to replace it in the dark on the side of the road (say, because the lights don't work). It's on the underside of the driver's footwell, requires a flashlight, screwdriver, and requires contorting one's body to see into it (followed by some therapy). This is really poor placement - period. 

I raise points about the vehicle in order to make others aware of what to look for, although I certainly didn't cover all the issues. Other things, like, poor outward visibility, a weird active cruise control (shuts down at roughly 20kph - although it does chime about it), child seats fit but leg room can be a premium (not to mention to watch kids heads when putting them into the car seat for fear of smacking their head on the roof), and some mechanical issues with the suspension (it's about to go back in for the 4th time because of sway bar issues). All said, other than the sway bar, it has been more reliable than my previous BMW 5 series touring, but still begs for better dependability. I can live with the engine stumbling - it hasn't cut out on me, so it's solely an idling problem.

MFT is a source of problems - navigation goes off if one outfits the truck with different sized tires (eg. winters are 18" - navigation is useless). System improvements haven't occurred for a long time, and the USA models get more functionality (Canadian Fords didn't get the benefit of traffic until last year or so - a function of Sirius). Updating is hardly straight forward as versioning on the system doesn't match patch numbers. It still occasionally shuts down into "maintenance mode" - ie. reboots, some functions don't work some times.

Again, I can live with most of the issues, but I also wish I had found out these kinds of issues in advance.

The stumbling at idle could be potentially carbon build up issues.  Or Ford really tunes these to run lean on idle which certainly can cause a slight stumble / miss at idle.

[mixmanmash]

Now that summer holiday season is winding down, I am starting to hear a lot of super-positive reports from people driving EcoBoost Expeditions and Explorers. Especially where travel over/through the Rockies is concerned. High altitude is an area where NA engines can't come close to a powerful turbo.

I would have loved a turbo on the '98 Buick 

Now you have realized the benefit of turbochargers - elevation.  Edmonton at 2200ft and Calgary at 3700ft benefit a huge amount from turbocharged vehicles as they are not affected nearly as much by elevation as naturally aspirated vehicles.

[redman]

Now that summer holiday season is winding down, I am starting to hear a lot of super-positive reports from people driving EcoBoost Expeditions and Explorers. Especially where travel over/through the Rockies is concerned. High altitude is an area where NA engines can't come close to a powerful turbo.

I would have loved a turbo on the '98 Buick 

Now you have realized the benefit of turbochargers - elevation.  Edmonton at 2200ft and Calgary at 3700ft benefit a huge amount from turbocharged vehicles as they are not affected nearly as much by elevation as naturally aspirated vehicles.

Better yet get a Jeep Grand Cherokee Diesel which would solve your altitude issue and give you extra climbing torque to boot.

http://wardsauto.com/ward039s-10-best-engines/2014-winner-chrysler-30l-ecodiesel-dohc-v-6

[Fobroader]

Now that summer holiday season is winding down, I am starting to hear a lot of super-positive reports from people driving EcoBoost Expeditions and Explorers. Especially where travel over/through the Rockies is concerned. High altitude is an area where NA engines can't come close to a powerful turbo.

I would have loved a turbo on the '98 Buick 

Now you have realized the benefit of turbochargers - elevation.  Edmonton at 2200ft and Calgary at 3700ft benefit a huge amount from turbocharged vehicles as they are not affected nearly as much by elevation as naturally aspirated vehicles.

Better yet get a Jeep Grand Cherokee Diesel Ford Super duty diesel or GM/Chevy Duramax diesel which would solve your altitude issue and give you extra climbing torque to boot.

fixed

[redman]

 ^^^
Fuel Economy ?

[Fobroader]

^^^
Fuel Economy ?

Yes....they have that....

[Sir Osis of Liver]

^^^
Fuel Economy ?

Yes....they have that....

[redman]

^^^
Fuel Economy ?

Yes....they have that....

Really the Duramax 6.6L Turbo-Diesel V8 engine and Ford 6.7L Tubro-Diesel engine vs the 3.0L Turbo Diesel. No comparison regarding fuel economy. The VM 3.0L TD is more than enough engine for something the size of the Explorer.

If you need more power out to the VM Motori 3.0 Bank offers a modified version : http://www.trucktrend.com/how-to/expert-advice/1208dp-banks-vm-motori-630t-v6-diesel-engine/

"A Banks version of the 3.0L VM Motori V-6 engine will be also be available to the general public as well, according to Banks. “Our initial build will be 240 hp and close to 500 lb ft with an engine weight under 500 pounds,” reports Bank"

[mixmanmash]

^^^
Fuel Economy ?

Yes....they have that....

Really the Duramax 6.6L Turbo-Diesel V8 engine and Ford 6.7L Tubro-Diesel engine vs the 3.0L Turbo Diesel. No comparison regarding fuel economy. The VM 3.0L TD is more than enough engine for something the size of the Explorer.

If you need more power out to the VM Motori 3.0 Bank offers a modified version : http://www.trucktrend.com/how-to/expert-advice/1208dp-banks-vm-motori-630t-v6-diesel-engine/

"A Banks version of the 3.0L VM Motori V-6 engine will be also be available to the general public as well, according to Banks. “Our initial build will be 240 hp and close to 500 lb ft with an engine weight under 500 pounds,” reports Bank"

I dunno.  I have driven the VM Motori 3.0 and it doesn't feel like it has the same oomph at highway speeds like the German V6 Diesels (VW, Porsche, Audi, MB).  Even the BMW 3L I6 diesel seems like it has more oomph.  Almost as if the Germans are providing numbers at the wheels where FCA is providing flywheel numbers.  Also, definitely not as smooth as the German Diesels.

[Fobroader]

^^^
Fuel Economy ?

Yes....they have that....

 

[redman]

^^^
Fuel Economy ?

Yes....they have that....

Really the Duramax 6.6L Turbo-Diesel V8 engine and Ford 6.7L Tubro-Diesel engine vs the 3.0L Turbo Diesel. No comparison regarding fuel economy. The VM 3.0L TD is more than enough engine for something the size of the Explorer.

If you need more power out to the VM Motori 3.0 Bank offers a modified version : http://www.trucktrend.com/how-to/expert-advice/1208dp-banks-vm-motori-630t-v6-diesel-engine/

"A Banks version of the 3.0L VM Motori V-6 engine will be also be available to the general public as well, according to Banks. “Our initial build will be 240 hp and close to 500 lb ft with an engine weight under 500 pounds,” reports Bank"

I dunno.  I have driven the VM Motori 3.0 and it doesn't feel like it has the same oomph at highway speeds like the German V6 Diesels (VW, Porsche, Audi, MB).  Even the BMW 3L I6 diesel seems like it has more oomph.  Almost as if the Germans are providing numbers at the wheels where FCA is providing flywheel numbers.  Also, definitely not as smooth as the German Diesels.

The comparison here is not VM 3.0L "oomph" it's about the F.E.. "Oomph" is discretionary.

Here is a short list of others that use VM Motori engines outside of North America in the diesel variants.
Chevrolet Colorado ,Ford Scorpio, Fiat Croma, Jeep Wrangler,Opel Frontera,Range Rover Turbo D,Toyota Hilux (2.4D),Toyota Land Cruiser,Mercruiser Cummins and the new generation of the iconic London Taxi (the TX4).
They also supply diesel engine to Marine, Industrial including farming and Power Generation.

[Fobroader]

^^^
Fuel Economy ?

Yes....they have that....

Really the Duramax 6.6L Turbo-Diesel V8 engine and Ford 6.7L Tubro-Diesel engine vs the 3.0L Turbo Diesel. No comparison regarding fuel economy. The VM 3.0L TD is more than enough engine for something the size of the Explorer.

If you need more power out to the VM Motori 3.0 Bank offers a modified version : http://www.trucktrend.com/how-to/expert-advice/1208dp-banks-vm-motori-630t-v6-diesel-engine/

"A Banks version of the 3.0L VM Motori V-6 engine will be also be available to the general public as well, according to Banks. “Our initial build will be 240 hp and close to 500 lb ft with an engine weight under 500 pounds,” reports Bank"

I dunno.  I have driven the VM Motori 3.0 and it doesn't feel like it has the same oomph at highway speeds like the German V6 Diesels (VW, Porsche, Audi, MB).  Even the BMW 3L I6 diesel seems like it has more oomph.  Almost as if the Germans are providing numbers at the wheels where FCA is providing flywheel numbers.  Also, definitely not as smooth as the German Diesels.

The comparison here is not VM 3.0L "oomph" it's about the F.E.. "Oomph" is discretionary.

Here is a short list of others that use VM Motori engines outside of North America in the diesel variants.
Chevrolet Colorado ,Ford Scorpio, Fiat Croma, Jeep Wrangler,Opel Frontera,Range Rover Turbo D,Toyota Hilux (2.4D),Toyota Land Cruiser,Mercruiser Cummins and the new generation of the iconic London Taxi (the TX4).
They also supply diesel engine to Marine, Industrial including farming and Power Generation.

I'm sorry, to me "ooomph" is hell of a lot higher on the list of priorities than FE. Unless its in BC ferry-esque, I've never worried a few l/100kms.

[mixmanmash]

^^^
Fuel Economy ?

Yes....they have that....

Really the Duramax 6.6L Turbo-Diesel V8 engine and Ford 6.7L Tubro-Diesel engine vs the 3.0L Turbo Diesel. No comparison regarding fuel economy. The VM 3.0L TD is more than enough engine for something the size of the Explorer.

If you need more power out to the VM Motori 3.0 Bank offers a modified version : http://www.trucktrend.com/how-to/expert-advice/1208dp-banks-vm-motori-630t-v6-diesel-engine/

"A Banks version of the 3.0L VM Motori V-6 engine will be also be available to the general public as well, according to Banks. “Our initial build will be 240 hp and close to 500 lb ft with an engine weight under 500 pounds,” reports Bank"

I dunno.  I have driven the VM Motori 3.0 and it doesn't feel like it has the same oomph at highway speeds like the German V6 Diesels (VW, Porsche, Audi, MB).  Even the BMW 3L I6 diesel seems like it has more oomph.  Almost as if the Germans are providing numbers at the wheels where FCA is providing flywheel numbers.  Also, definitely not as smooth as the German Diesels.

The comparison here is not VM 3.0L "oomph" it's about the F.E.. "Oomph" is discretionary.

Here is a short list of others that use VM Motori engines outside of North America in the diesel variants.
Chevrolet Colorado ,Ford Scorpio, Fiat Croma, Jeep Wrangler,Opel Frontera,Range Rover Turbo D,Toyota Hilux (2.4D),Toyota Land Cruiser,Mercruiser Cummins and the new generation of the iconic London Taxi (the TX4).
They also supply diesel engine to Marine, Industrial including farming and Power Generation.

Sure.  But I am staying that the VM Motori diesel isn't quite up to par with the Germans in terms of NVH and actual power.  Fuel economy might be on par, but that won't help you much when you're trying to pass that camper on a short passing lane in the Rockies.

[redman]

 ^^^^
I have not driven the JGC Diesel yet but Car and driver remarks:
"At idle, this Grand Cherokee further puts to rest old stereotypes about diesel engines. Although the EcoDiesel emits the typical compression-ignition clatter, it’s no louder or intrusive than is the V-8, even from the outside. And the torque is great fun; it provides instant punch for day-to-day dicing in traffic. Mind you, it peaks at 2000 rpm and the redline is 4800, but the high number of forward gears means you’ll almost never find yourself wanting for more muscle."
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2014-jeep-grand-cherokee-ecodiesel-v-6-first-drive-review

Road and track :"I drove round-trip from Michigan to New York towing a trailer with my Formula Ford and spare parts," editor-in-chief Larry Webster noted after the Jeep's maiden voyage. "Phenomenal range and mileage and all that torque made quick work of the Pennsylvania mountains, even with my heavy load."
 http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/road-tests/reviews/a25823/long-term-test-wrap-up-2014-jeep-grand-cherokee-overland-4x4-ecodiesel/

" the diesel’s immediate torque (available at a low, low 2,000 rpm) is not only felt right off the line, but also during passing manoeuvers on the highway."
 http://driving.ca/jeep/grand-cherokee/reviews/road-test/suv-review-2014-jeep-grand-cherokee-ecodiesel-summit

Power is subjective. NVH maybe another thing.

[Northernridge]

Ever since I saw the black OPP Explorers prowling around Northern Ontario I've kinda wanted one.

[Snowman]

Ever since I saw the black OPP Explorers prowling around Northern Ontario I've kinda wanted one.

Standard issue here, they look kind of sinister. I can dig it.

[Fobroader]

Ever since I saw the black OPP Explorers prowling around Northern Ontario I've kinda wanted one.

Our town Peace Officer has a blacked out one...yeah, looks pretty good.

[Wildsau]

Ever since I saw the black OPP Explorers prowling around Northern Ontario I've kinda wanted one.

One of the Ford technical guys was telling me how hardcore some of the police-issue vehicles requirements are, and how regular consumers benefit greatly from that. One example that really stuck in my mind is that Explorers have to be able to hit a curb straight on at 35 mph (so 56 km/h) and keep on driving, without a blow-out or damage to the suspension. That's pretty serious stuff, and if the suspension is engineered to take that kind of abuse, that's good news for the average Joe, whose Explorer will likely not be driven under those conditions. Except for my wife's maybe.

[EV-Light]

^^^^
I have not driven the JGC Diesel yet but Car and driver remarks:
"At idle, this Grand Cherokee further puts to rest old stereotypes about diesel engines. Although the EcoDiesel emits the typical compression-ignition clatter, it’s no louder or intrusive than is the V-8, even from the outside. And the torque is great fun; it provides instant punch for day-to-day dicing in traffic. Mind you, it peaks at 2000 rpm and the redline is 4800, but the high number of forward gears means you’ll almost never find yourself wanting for more muscle."
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2014-jeep-grand-cherokee-ecodiesel-v-6-first-drive-review

Road and track :"I drove round-trip from Michigan to New York towing a trailer with my Formula Ford and spare parts," editor-in-chief Larry Webster noted after the Jeep's maiden voyage. "Phenomenal range and mileage and all that torque made quick work of the Pennsylvania mountains, even with my heavy load."
 http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/road-tests/reviews/a25823/long-term-test-wrap-up-2014-jeep-grand-cherokee-overland-4x4-ecodiesel/

" the diesel’s immediate torque (available at a low, low 2,000 rpm) is not only felt right off the line, but also during passing manoeuvers on the highway."
 http://driving.ca/jeep/grand-cherokee/reviews/road-test/suv-review-2014-jeep-grand-cherokee-ecodiesel-summit

Power is subjective. NVH maybe another thing.

interesting...all that torque can't keep up with the Explorer though:

Ford Explorer Sport:
Zero to 60 mph: 5.9 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 15.3 sec
Zero to 120 mph: 25.0 sec
Standing ¼-mile: 14.5 sec @ 97 mph
EPA city/highway driving: 16/22 mpg
C/D observed: 18 mpg

Ford Explorer V6
Zero to 60 mph: 7.5 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 21.3 sec
Street start, 5-60 mph: 7.9 sec
Standing ¼-mile: 16.0 sec @ 89 mph
EPA city/highway driving: 17/25 mpg
C/D observed: 18 mpg

Jeep Grand Cherokee Diesel
Zero to 60 mph: 8.0 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 24.9 sec
Street start, 5-60 mph: 9.0 sec
Standing ¼-mile: 16.1 sec @ 84 mph
EPA city/highway driving: 21/28 mpg
C/D observed: 24 mpg

Jeep Grand Cherokee V6
Zero to 60 mph: 7.5 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 20.0 sec
Zero to 120 mph: 35.8 sec
Rolling start, 5-60 mph: 7.9 sec
Standing ¼-mile: 15.7 sec @ 90 mph
EPA city/highway driving: 17/24 mpg
C/D observed: 17 mpg

source: C&D instrumented test