Topic: Day-by-Day Review: 2016 Scion FR-S; Day 1

[Autos_Editor]

  Does the 2016 FR-S still possess what it takes to compete in a tough market?
Read More...

[redman]

Two points :

1) Turbo option ?

2) Convertible option ?

It's time for ver. 2.0. STI or FT-86 G Sports.

Three years (2012) without a major chagne now makes this car seem long in the tooth in this market.   

[greengs]

I do see quite few used ones for sale in local ads.  BRZ as well.  I think the problem is, to really have fun with this car you have to drive it a little more aggressively.  Much as been made about how easily it slides around.  Can't typically do that on public roads though.  For me this would be a fun weekend car or something to take to the track, not necessarily a daily driver.

[Noto]

The problem is, how much fun can one really have on our traffic-filled streets?  How about the rutted, pot-holed streets?

These twins don't quite live up to any one great purpose in Canada (at least) - not powerful enough to be a track star, and not feature-rich enough to be a sporty daily driver.  The firm ride would also be a deterrent.

The only folks I see driving the twins around are young'ns with odd-mods, like these ones:

[Nuttygent]

  While it's true that a turbo would be no brainer, I'm thinking if they just upped the displacement to 2.2 or 2.3. A little more torque and power would keep it interesting without affecting any of the brilliant handling.

[5 Wheel Drive]

I remember being in the Subaru dealer when the twins came out a couple of years ago.  The guy I bought the Forester from said there was a waiting list for the BRZ.  Every unit they were getting for the next 8-10 months was already sold.  Didn't even have one to put in the showroom.

When I was there in July, there was 2 of them in the showroom, and they were on sale...

[JohnnyMac]

Everyone knows the FRS should be supercharged (that's TRD's thing) and the BRZ should be turbocharged (that's STi's thing). 

I just couldn't get over the horrid interior and the ultra harsh ride in these things.  Mind you it's amazing on a back road.  Such a confusing car.  Personally if I wanted a Japanese light RWD sports car the only option is MX-5.

[Noto]

  While it's true that a turbo would be no brainer, I'm thinking if they just upped the displacement to 2.2 or 2.3. A little more torque and power would keep it interesting without affecting any of the brilliant handling.

...or a 2.5L?  Say, the FB25?

[wing]

I live beside the highway where I haven't seen a cop in three years and there is zero traffic.   Just saying....

[Sir Osis of Liver]

Sports coupes are a tough sell these days. Small ones even more so.

I don't think it has as much to do with the deficiencies of the car as much as it being a form factor that just isn't en vogue at the moment.

[SaskSpecV]

I remember being in the Subaru dealer when the twins came out a couple of years ago.  The guy I bought the Forester from said there was a waiting list for the BRZ.  Every unit they were getting for the next 8-10 months was already sold.  Didn't even have one to put in the showroom.

When I was there in July, there was 2 of them in the showroom, and they were on sale...

Asked the Subaru sales manager about that a month ago.  They had 3 BRZs on the lot, two of which were featured fairly prominently. He said they couldn't move them easily, and didn't want to bring any in.  Gave the classic reasoning (and probably truthful):

1. Lots of young guys (kids) come in to look at them, but don't have any cash (or decent credit) to buy one. 

2. Somewhat older guys with cash (i.e. my mid-30s demographic) might have the cash, and would sill like to drive a sporty car, but don't have enough disposable cash to justify a strictly "toy" car, and aren't willing to make the comprises required to use a BRZ as a daily driver.  Either based on their life situation (kids), or because of the firm ride/lack of features makes the car less desirable as a DD.  But he'd happily show those customers a WRX... (BTW, he also agreed that not having a WRX hatch was dumb, but knew nothing about one on the horizon).

3.  The retired/ing boomers have enough disposable cash for a strictly "toy" car, but "they can't bend down low enough to get into the damn thing! (his words, not mine)  IMO, I don't know how many in that demographic would really be interested in a spartan Japanese small coupe anyway though...

[Noto]

I'm getting sick and tired on this " you can't use more than 250 horsepower on the street" nonsense.

I didn't say that.

The problem is, how much fun can one really have on our traffic-filled streets?  How about the rutted, pot-holed streets?

These twins don't quite live up to any one great purpose in Canada (at least) - not powerful enough to be a track star, and not feature-rich enough to be a sporty daily driver.  The firm ride would also be a deterrent.

I wasn't talking about power, but the ability to go sideways, to take on-ramps quickly, etc.

Mon/Wed I get on the 407, then 400.  I can't even exploit all of the Corolla's power because there's so much traffic that I never have the ramp to myself.  Tues/Thurs/Fri I get on the 401.  It's worse.  Usually, I'm doing stop n' go on the on-ramp.  No better on the way home.  While the FRS/BRZ would be more fun, in theory, I'd rather drive a Corolla daily. 

On weekends, I get a good on-ramp.  It wouldn't be enough to sway me to buy a more 'fun' car though.  For my purposes, I need a car that strikes a good balance between fun to drive and comfortable for the daily grind.  This is why something like the Golf TSI is more appealing to me than something like the FR-S (not saying direct competitors, but most cars strike a more comfortable balance for those in the cities or suburbs).  Once you move out to the smaller towns, yeah, a more fun car becomes palatable - but the FRS/BRZ are, for most people (who do fear the winter), seasonal cars.  At that price, the Miata is better (as pointed out), the Mustang is more 'luxurious' and feature-rich, etc.  I just don't see many instances where the FRS/BRZ, with the singular purpose of sporting pretensions, is the smart buy.

[Fobroader]

Lots of options to make these go faster





Or even with the stock engine

Blower


Turbo

[Noto]

I wasn't directly responding to your statement as there have been multiple comments in the vein of what I was talking about over the past couple of weeks. I just used it as a springboard to vent. That's why I didn't quote your original post.

Ah, my misunderstanding! 

[Blueprint]

(...) I need a car (...)

This ^^ 

[tpl]

I remember being in the Subaru dealer when the twins came out a couple of years ago.  The guy I bought the Forester from said there was a waiting list for the BRZ.  Every unit they were getting for the next 8-10 months was already sold.  Didn't even have one to put in the showroom.

When I was there in July, there was 2 of them in the showroom, and they were on sale...

Asked the Subaru sales manager about that a month ago.  They had 3 BRZs on the lot, two of which were featured fairly prominently. He said they couldn't move them easily, and didn't want to bring any in.  Gave the classic reasoning (and probably truthful):

1. Lots of young guys (kids) come in to look at them, but don't have any cash (or decent credit) to buy one. 

2. Somewhat older guys with cash (i.e. my mid-30s demographic) might have the cash, and would sill like to drive a sporty car, but don't have enough disposable cash to justify a strictly "toy" car, and aren't willing to make the comprises required to use a BRZ as a daily driver.  Either based on their life situation (kids), or because of the firm ride/lack of features makes the car less desirable as a DD.  But he'd happily show those customers a WRX... (BTW, he also agreed that not having a WRX hatch was dumb, but knew nothing about one on the horizon).

3.  The retired/ing boomers have enough disposable cash for a strictly "toy" car, but "they can't bend down low enough to get into the damn thing! (his words, not mine)  IMO, I don't know how many in that demographic would really be interested in a spartan Japanese small coupe anyway though...

As one of those Boomers... Why would I buy one of these when I could buy a Miata or give the budget a kick and buy a CPO Cayman.    Or be sensible and get a Golf R  in the middle...or make Snowman an offer on his TT.       I don't care about the FWD/RWD argument.

For sure I have not seen may around here

[Northernridge]

Part of the problem is that Toyota/Subaru underestimated the number of 'enthusiasts' willing to actually buy the affordable, RWD, manual sportscar they claimed they would if one ever became available. Not anybody on this forum of course. 

[Blueprint]

As a 20-something, I had a Celica. It was about as low as the twins are, but fwd got it through winters, it did not require premium and the room under the hatch was amazing. Rear seat was 2+2 tight, but actually useable, unlike the twins. My car had a fairly relaxed ride in town, yet handled rural road sweepers with grace and pace. It was no track toy, but you could live with it on a daily basis.

We can complain all we want about bland "committee" cars, but the sciobarus are the extreme opposite - too focused on driving fun at the expense of daily use. As such, they join jetskis, RVs and motorcycles as toys with short ownership and high classifieds presence.

Current trends don't help, of course. Where are the Preludes, Sciroccos and 240SXs of our youths? Sleek, affordable coupes have almost vanished, replaced by hotted-up versions of regular compacts. Not that these are bad, au contraire, but where's the style? For all the wrongs they have, the twins look fantastic and beyond their price in person. I'm hoping for a more polished gen2, hopefully at similar prices.

[Noto]

(...) I need a car (...)

This ^^ 

I'm just a crabby old man, really.

Nah, you're aiight!  (that's young kid-speak for all-right, old timer!) 

[Blueprint]

(...) I need a car (...)

This ^^ 

I'm just a crabby old man, really.

Nah, you're aiight!  (that's young kid-speak for all-right, old timer!) 

At your service   

Hey, my first car was a Corolla too, but rwd with a stick:



...but I was 18 at the time