Author Topic: Monday Rant: You Don't Need Synthetic Oil (Read 22515 times)

Autos_Editor · « **on:** May 25, 2015, 06:25:03 am »

For many drivers, synthetic oil might be overkill.
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Ex-airbalancer · « **Reply #1 on:** May 25, 2015, 06:43:11 am »

Are you really having money, synthetic oil you can easily do 25,000 km between oil changes ( recommended levels for a 2000 e46) , old time oil is every 5,000 km ,

jamesautos · « **Reply #2 on:** May 25, 2015, 07:12:23 am »

Stop your Monday rant...

majority of people don't do their own oil change and they don't even know there are different weight of motor oil. People rarely do oil change when they are suppose to anyways. Most people use quik lube places or worse Walmart to get their oil change for $30...
I highly doubt synthetic oil is high on people's mind. But for those who do, it's not a matter of necessity. Their cars are their babies that always deserve the best. It's like feeding your baby regular baby food vs organic baby food...are there differences? Yes... do I care what you think about how I feed my baby? no

tpl · « **Reply #3 on:** May 25, 2015, 07:31:40 am »

I just put the manufacturer specified oil in my engines and change it at sensible intervals.

Q5 VW spec synthetic 5w-40 they say change at 16,000 I change at 8000
Fit This MkII fit specifies a Honda 0w-20 which like all (AFAIK) 0w oils is at least a partial synthetic. Change interval on maintenance minder is between 11 and
12000 or once a year...we do it once a year as the car has only just got to 12,000 after 22 months.

Previous. M-B B250 maintenance minder said every 12,000 or once a year with an MB spec 5w-40 or 0w-40 synthetic. Sold just as it got to 12,000.
Mk5 GTI, A4 1.8T both said a VW spec synthetic and change at 16,000 Both changed at 8000.
BMW 330Xi 5w-30 or 5w-40 synthetic at about 22,000 to 25,000 kms Changed every 8000
MkI Fit 5w-20 dino oil, maintenance minder on that car went off at 8000 or once a year. Only in one year did we ( she actually!) do enough kms to change
before the year was up.

The only one of the above which used any oil was the BMW which used perhaps 1/4 litre in 8000 kms and stopped using oil at around 20,000 kms or so.

So from this I draw the conclusion that the FGC engine manufacturers see an advantage in synthetic oil for normal road cars in this climate...why would one argue? Let alone any potential warranty issues.

northsparrow · « **Reply #4 on:** May 25, 2015, 07:56:38 am »

I agree with Airbalancer.

I use top spec PAO synthetic rated for 40,000 km with a long life filter and change it once a year while driving a fraction
of the yearly maximum.

After 10 years my engine is in perfect condition plus I save a lot of cash and more importantly time by not doing as many oil changes.

Off the shelf, mineral oil based synthetic can be picked up on sale for the same price as conventional oil so why use old dinosaurs to
lubricate your engine?

pcsp · « **Reply #5 on:** May 25, 2015, 08:01:06 am »

I'm also a fan of saving money and getting value. That's why I don't seek out the most expensive synthetic and change it every 3,000-5,000 km. I choose synthetic because of the PROVEN benefits (not the anecdotal stuff), it has in both everyday driving and extreme use. No one can know when they will subject their vehicle to occasions of extreme use. May not be intentional, may not be constant, but it will happen. I'm quite comfortable having the oil changed twice a year no matter the mileage (May and November) and using synthetic for which I usually pay between $15 and $25 per four liters. Probably costs me an extra $10-$25 per vehicle annually.

Great_Big_Abyss · « **Reply #6 on:** May 25, 2015, 10:23:12 am »

Justin,

You should have mentioned the API seal that is on bottles of oil. As long as the bottle of oil you buy as the API seal on it, it's good enough for you to run in your car, given the right viscosity, of course.

AND, what do you run in your viper? I would argue that the big, understressed 8.0L V10 in the Viper does less work per cube than the frantic little 2.0L in the MR2.

mmret · « **Reply #7 on:** May 25, 2015, 11:16:13 am »

Given that the main cost is labour + time + hassle I'd rather put the good stuff in and change it when the maintenance minder is up.

For the GLK + V60 its around 15-16k.
The Acura is only 9k but it has only 4.4L sump.

Snowman · « **Reply #8 on:** May 25, 2015, 11:41:44 am »

Good thing I'm not one of the many. Why cheap out on oil to save a few bucks on cars worth $xx,xxx.xx?

johngenx · « **Reply #9 on:** May 25, 2015, 12:28:08 pm »

Anyone that lives somewhere where it gets cold in the winter knows one good reason to use synthetic oil: much easier cold starts and fast circulation.

And I agree with Snowie: in terms of operating a car, the additional cost of synthetic over regular oil is pretty small.

You will also probably recoup some of that money in resale. When I have sold cars (instead of wearing them out completely!) the presentation of anal-retentive service records including full-synth oil means I've usually sold at the higher end of the price spectrum.

wing · « **Reply #10 on:** May 25, 2015, 12:39:00 pm »

All my cars call for synthetic in the manual. Who am I to argue with the people that designed my car?

Cold starts and extreme heat, I think it's worth it. I change the oil twice a year around 8k.

ArticSteve · « **Reply #11 on:** May 25, 2015, 12:42:52 pm »

Nice presentation from Mobil UNO

http://www.exxonmobil.com/AP-English/Files/about_who_Mobil1_supersyn_eng.pdf

0W40 Mobil 1 Eurospec for the BEAST

. Currently $5.79 litre x 6 @ your neighbourhood Esso Lubricant Distributor.

Like most domestic and Asian makers, Ford calls for 5W20

Solstice2006 · « **Reply #12 on:** May 25, 2015, 12:44:41 pm »

Quote from: wing on May 25, 2015, 12:39:00 pm

All my cars call for synthetic in the manual. Who am I to argue with the people that designed my car?

Cold starts and extreme heat, I think it's worth it. I change the oil twice a year around 8k.

Exactly, I just go with the service recommendations. Mine says 4 months or 8k.

tortoise · « **Reply #13 on:** May 25, 2015, 12:59:22 pm »

Every 4 months seems way to frequent. So, if you drive 20k km per year you are changing your oil every 5k km.

That a dealership schedule or a Mazda schedule.

I use synthetic (typically group III) but I pick it up on sale so the extra cost is negligible. We routinely have mornings below -20C and the cars seem to start and get going easier.

Triple Bob · « **Reply #14 on:** May 25, 2015, 01:20:08 pm »

Quote from: johngenx on May 25, 2015, 12:28:08 pm

Anyone that lives somewhere where it gets cold in the winter knows one good reason to use synthetic oil: much easier cold starts and fast circulation.

And I agree with Snowie: in terms of operating a car, the additional cost of synthetic over regular oil is pretty small.

You will also probably recoup some of that money in resale. When I have sold cars (instead of wearing them out completely!) the presentation of anal-retentive service records including full-synth oil means I've usually sold at the higher end of the price spectrum.

Agreed.

This article has so much wrong in it it's unbelievable that it's published on a car site.

Quote

It might help you get better mileage. It might offer more protection. It might make your engine last longer.

Might, might, might.

My logic is simpler, and backed up my numerous mechanic pals.

Quote

Have you seen how they torture-test engines? Or how they torture-test engine oils?

Have you?

The extreme load testing isn't done 'beyond redline', it's done a full load for extended hours to essentially break the engine as fast as possible. Then they can find out why, and blend different additives to help alleviate that particular issue. The reason why this is relevant to Canada is annual temps from -40C to +40C, plus many short journeys and cold starts essentially produces similar wear characteristics.

With a good quality synthetic oil (better base and more expensive additives) there is much better resistance to shear, reduced breakdown, and significantly increased film strength. The film strength part alone can reduce metal-metal contact by a significant amount, especially in harsh climates such as Canada.

erich · « **Reply #15 on:** May 25, 2015, 01:30:21 pm »

SAAB and VW/Audi turbo engines had (have?) a sludging issue that required syntethic oil only. I will keep using full synth for any turbo engine (Genesis Coupe).
I use mineral oil in NA engines in non-performance cars (Civic, Forester).

Fobroader · « **Reply #16 on:** May 25, 2015, 01:45:45 pm »

Every car Ive even owned has gotten synthetic, for the extra few bucks, I think its worth it. Especially at -40 when the cars been outside of work the whole day.

HeliDriver · « **Reply #17 on:** May 25, 2015, 02:01:11 pm »

I sort of agree with the article, just given its limited premise: car is driven summer only.

I used to run Dino oil in my Civic and had no issues over 270,000 kms. And that car saw lots of track time and regular trips to its 8,000 rpm redline. (But I did switch to semi-syn "winter" oil for half the year.) I'd probably just go synthetic year-round in that car if I did it over again, but at the time I felt better about 5,000 km oil and filter changes than leaving synthetic (and the filter) in for longer.

But in general, synthetic is kind of a no-brainer, not only because winter, but also because it's not that much more expensive and a lot of new cars specifically call for it.

jaari · « **Reply #18 on:** May 25, 2015, 02:04:30 pm »

I wonder what my Honda's 0/20 'full' synthetic is?
Is it a 'true' synthetic as some are just dino based with synthetic additives

Our old '99 Accent got nothing but Supertech 5/30 1.99 a litre stuff and ahemm Fram filter every 5,000 lol
Her engine never had a issue in the 250,000 kms we had her.
The '15 Honda Crv so far has 4000kms on it and 90% oil life left.
I'm leery on leaving it in so long, but I guess the manufacturer knows what they are doing ?

ArticSteve · « **Reply #19 on:** May 25, 2015, 02:27:51 pm »

Is it a 'true' synthetic as some are just dino based with synthetic additives

It will be a group III. Be interesting to know which oil company supplies it. Honda and Toyota dealers have a bulk 0W20 synthetic "blend" just to add confusion.