Author Topic: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks  (Read 18591 times)

Offline Autos_Editor

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Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« on: October 17, 2014, 06:30:12 am »

The hatch is king.
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Offline quadzilla

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2014, 06:56:29 am »
Quote
On paper, the 3 shows the smallest overall cargo capacity when its truncated height is factored in, but subjectively, the depth of the space should suit most needs better than in the other two.

Shouldn't hatches be able to swallow large boxes (height) so the sloping hatch of the Mazda3 would be a negative. Also wish you guys posted real measurements of all three trunks.

When I saw this photo I thought it was the sedan version of the Mazda3.


Offline hemusbull

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2014, 08:03:31 am »
A comparison without any number achieved by the authors? Just EPA, CRA and manufacturers'?

Offline Steve C

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2014, 08:05:19 am »
How is the Mazda3 with the 2.5 a good value? It starts at $27,000 and you still don't get everything at that price. Manual transmission is the same price as Automatic, so no break on price there. That's alot for a small car. You are into GTI and Civic Si territory now. Not to mention Honda Accord Sport, Accord Coupe and a bunch more. I haven't heard any reviews of the 2.5 saying it is particularly quick, which I thought it would be. Throw in the reduced rear hatch capacity, rear visibility, the complete reduction of all passenger compartment storage over the last generation, that stupid tacked on unit on the dash and you have a vehicle that in many ways is a step back from the last generation. Made in Mexico now vs Japan for the last generation.

Yes, it is a hatch, which many of the cars I mentioned aren't, but when you price out a Mazda3 2.5 you have to start asking yourself what you can buy for that money, or less in some cases.

Offline Jaeger

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #4 on: October 17, 2014, 08:07:05 am »
Glad to hear the Golf drives like last year's GTI. Less glad to hear that it is priced like last year's GTI.
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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #5 on: October 17, 2014, 08:21:10 am »
Quote
On paper, the 3 shows the smallest overall cargo capacity when its truncated height is factored in, but subjectively, the depth of the space should suit most needs better than in the other two.

Shouldn't hatches be able to swallow large boxes (height) so the sloping hatch of the Mazda3 would be a negative. Also wish you guys posted real measurements of all three trunks.

When I saw this photo I thought it was the sedan version of the Mazda3.

I've been able to fit some surprisingly large boxes in my 2014 Mazda 3.  A Kamado BBQ, an Ikea living room chair, etc.  I can't see anyone needing more space. 

Also to note, the rear hatch may slope but the lower lip sits forward of the trunk's upper trim by a good 12-16", after which you gain another ~3" of depth.  That means actually leveraging a box into the trunk is made so much easier. 

The Kia is a gas guzzler unfortunately and the Golf is just as expensive as the Mazda 3 GT.  I think the comparison here is a completely fair one. 

Offline Weels

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #6 on: October 17, 2014, 08:30:19 am »
Is Yarkony getting an early start on Movember? 




Offline Kris78

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #7 on: October 17, 2014, 09:10:31 am »
To me, this was the quote of the article:

"the excellent engine, steering, braking, practical space utilization and comfort; are all present and accounted for even if you buy a $20,000 Trendline trim "

Yes, you can option any of these to crazy expense levels. However, with the Golf you get all the stuff that made it win in the base model.

When it comes time for my next ride, I'm going to be taking a closer look at VW for sure...

Offline JacobBlack

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #8 on: October 17, 2014, 09:12:55 am »
Is Yarkony getting an early start on Movember? 



We begged him to shave it off. He won't. Right now he looks like a now-dead Russian dictator...

Offline aquadorhj

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #9 on: October 17, 2014, 09:45:18 am »
To me, this was the quote of the article:

"the excellent engine, steering, braking, practical space utilization and comfort; are all present and accounted for even if you buy a $20,000 Trendline trim "

Yes, you can option any of these to crazy expense levels. However, with the Golf you get all the stuff that made it win in the base model.

When it comes time for my next ride, I'm going to be taking a closer look at VW for sure...

Comfort is even better with standard suspension of Trendline, but Highline comes with excellent leather wrapped Sports Seats.


Driving thrills makes my wallet lighter.. and therefore makes me faster because i'm shedding weight... :D

Offline jyarkony

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #10 on: October 17, 2014, 09:47:51 am »
To me, this was the quote of the article:

"the excellent engine, steering, braking, practical space utilization and comfort; are all present and accounted for even if you buy a $20,000 Trendline trim "

Yes, you can option any of these to crazy expense levels. However, with the Golf you get all the stuff that made it win in the base model.

When it comes time for my next ride, I'm going to be taking a closer look at VW for sure...

not to mention you can get a 6-speed manual diesel in any trim, though it is a steep $2,500 for the TDI powertrain.
Do I contradict myself?
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Offline DriverJeff

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #11 on: October 17, 2014, 09:52:19 am »
To me, this was the quote of the article:

"the excellent engine, steering, braking, practical space utilization and comfort; are all present and accounted for even if you buy a $20,000 Trendline trim "

Yes, you can option any of these to crazy expense levels. However, with the Golf you get all the stuff that made it win in the base model.

When it comes time for my next ride, I'm going to be taking a closer look at VW for sure...

not to mention you can get a 6-speed manual diesel in any trim, though it is a steep $2,500 for the TDI powertrain.

Yeah, and then you'd need to drive A LOT to justify it.  The 1.8T is such a great engine (especially as a base-model offering), that it'd be tough to convince me to go for the diesel as much as I like the TDI.

The past:00 BMW M Rdstr, 19 Jetta, 15 Ducati Scrambler, 09 Triumph Bonneville, 98 Boxster, 17 Kawi Z900, 05 LS 430, 99 LS 400, 17 Subaru STI, 14 Triumph STR, 15 WRX, 09 Ducati Monster 1100,  08 335i, 06 Suzuki SV650S, 06 330i, 06 MX-5, 04 Audi A4, 03 Suzuki SV650S, 98 328i, 93 Civic Si, 85 Corolla

Offline jyarkony

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #12 on: October 17, 2014, 09:53:13 am »
A comparison without any number achieved by the authors? Just EPA, CRA and manufacturers'?

We were working on one of our side-by-side spec tables, but ran out of gas last night... I've put in the basic prices/option and fuel consumption for now until that is ready.

I was surprised to see that the Kia was so close to the Golf and 3 on test day, considering its EPA number is significantly higher, though it did climb in the ensuing days, while the others dropped....

2015 Mazda3 Sport GT
Price as Tested: $30,490
Observed fuel consumption: 9.8 L/100 km
EPA rating: 9.0/6.7/8.1 L/100 km


2015 Volkswagen Golf 1.8 TSI Highline
Price as Tested: $33,585
Observed fuel consumption: 9.6 L/100 km
EPA rating: 9.4/6.5/8.1 L/100 km


2015 Kia Forte5 SX

Price as Tested: $29,980
Observed fuel consumption: 9.9 L/100 km
EPA rating: 11.2/8.1/9.8 L/100 km

Offline jyarkony

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #13 on: October 17, 2014, 09:54:25 am »
Is Yarkony getting an early start on Movember? 


We begged him to shave it off. He won't. Right now he looks like a now-dead Russian dictator...

I like to think of it as Moctober...

Offline DriverJeff

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #14 on: October 17, 2014, 09:59:46 am »
...and for official cargo capacity figures:

Mazda3 Sport =
572L (behind rear seats)/1,334 (rear seats folded)

Kia Forte5 =
657 L (behind rear seats) / no figure given with seats folded


VW Golf =
670 L (behind rear seats) / 1,520 (rear seats folded)


To elaborate on the write up, when we put items in the trunk (ie. the car seats from Mr Yarkony's kids), it became evident that the practical space of the Mazda wasn't as negatively affected as the numbers suggest.  There's good length to the hatch area in the Mazda, but if you're trying to move a giant cube, the Mazda's sloped rear will make it problematic.

Offline DriverJeff

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #15 on: October 17, 2014, 10:00:43 am »

We begged him to shave it off. He won't. Right now he looks like a now-dead Russian dictator...

Did you say "looks like" or "acts like"?   ;D

Offline EV-Light

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #16 on: October 17, 2014, 10:31:19 am »
A comparison without any number achieved by the authors? Just EPA, CRA and manufacturers'?

We were working on one of our side-by-side spec tables, but ran out of gas last night... I've put in the basic prices/option and fuel consumption for now until that is ready.

I was surprised to see that the Kia was so close to the Golf and 3 on test day, considering its EPA number is significantly higher, though it did climb in the ensuing days, while the others dropped....

2015 Mazda3 Sport GT
Price as Tested: $30,490
Observed fuel consumption: 9.8 L/100 km
EPA rating: 9.0/6.7/8.1 L/100 km


2015 Volkswagen Golf 1.8 TSI Highline
Price as Tested: $33,585
Observed fuel consumption: 9.6 L/100 km
EPA rating: 9.4/6.5/8.1 L/100 km


2015 Kia Forte5 SX

Price as Tested: $29,980
Observed fuel consumption: 9.9 L/100 km
EPA rating: 11.2/8.1/9.8 L/100 km

one would have to REALLY want a hatch to ignore all the other amazing cars that can be had for $30+...for me it'd be an easy call - Ford Fusion Titanium or Honda Accord Touring. Perhaps...if I still wanted a hatchback, a RAV4 XLE w/ NAV or a Ford Escape Titanium...

no wonder why hatchbacks are a dying bread...

Offline Noto

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #17 on: October 17, 2014, 10:37:59 am »
Quote
with only one option missing: an automatic transmission. That was a bold move, but in character for the brand known for the catchphrase I refuse to ever utter or type. (Side note: please move on, Mazda.) That’s right, manual transmission aficionados aren’t relegated to the lower trims or denied any of the options or engines (the 2.5L SkyActiv in this case) that shiftless shoppers can opt for. Bravo.
See, that disappoints me.  The transmission differences always end up being part of the equation, and Mazda was smart - they knew that an automotive journalist would prefer the stick.  It doesn't matter.  I love you guys and know that you compare things well, but there's just that visceral feeling of driving a stick that makes the competition a little loaded, making your job all the more difficult.  I can only imagine how distraught you are ;)

So, I continue reading...reading...reading...and:
Quote
3rd Place: 2015 Mazda3 Sport GT
:o :o :o
WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT?  I still haven't read a single word beyond "GT" as quoted above, but there's...just...WHAT?!  They even sent you a stick!!!!!!!!!!! 

I knew that you guys always review well!  Nice to see the Mazda not win a comparo for once :P

Quote
And those titles were won before Mazda was blessing Canadian buyers with a crisp-shifting six-speed manual transmission in the top trim of their sporty compact hatchback – now they’re really going to fly off the lots….
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Quote
In this test, the beloved Hiroshima hatchback took only two category wins: cargo space and transmission
Yup...there it is.  I knew it was coming.

Quote
compromises ingress and egress to both front and rear passenger spaces, and limits visibility when parking.
Wholeheartedly agree.  Difficulty in outward visibility, ingress/egress, and seat comfort are the biggest complaints of mine with the MIL's Mazda3.

Quote
at $29,980, lowest priced in test.

:o :o :o

HOLY CRAP.  Seriously, when did cars get to be so damn expensive?!  At $29,995, you can get a base WRX!!!  Oh wait, no more hatch ;)  Sorry, that was a crack at the lack of a hatch.

Quote
the Forte5 still lacks in refinement
My take on most Kias mirrors this.  I really have come to like their strategy of value, engineering advancement, and what seems to be decent (at least acceptable) reliability.

...but Kia/Hyundai just don't seem to be getting the whole refinement thing down.  Look at the dashboard.  Functional?  Absolutely.  Pretty?  Dear lord no.  It's a sea of black plastics with little accenting.  It looks like a 2001 Subaru interior, maybe a little rounder.  Red backlighting is also a big let-down. 

Quote
The leather actually looks and feels like leather, not like the Forte5’s, which might have come from plastic livestock.


...but you hit the word "refinement" when you discuss the power delivery of the little turbo: ok acceleration, ok, keeping up, POWAHHHHH, ok, running out of steam.  I disliked it in the Mazda CX-7 and I would continue to dislike it anywhere.  Turbo cars shouldn't have a "whoosh" of power in the middle - it should build evenly, and I understand that's what the vee-dub's 1.8T does very well.

Quote
Rumour has it that when Senior Editor Yarkony eats his Alpha Bits cereal in the morning, he sets aside the Vs and the Ws until the end because they’re special letters to him.
:rofl2: :rofl2:

Quote
But we are biased. As Mr. Yarkony states, “We are biased in favour of refined, well-rounded vehicles that also offer an enjoyable driving experience.”
I agree.  I think you're absolutely right.  This is why people buy the Lexi, the Bimmers, the Audis, etc.  It's not about luxury by features (because Kia would kill it!), but about as Lexus coins it, "the pursuit of perfection."  I would argue that this is what makes the Corolla/Civic/F-150/Camry/Accord etc best-sellers: they've been around the longest, been refined the most, and have developed a reputation for excellence.

VW has a reputation for building greatly-engineered cars, refined to the tee, but reliability remains suspect.  Hence my concern when I found out that they were going to start manufacturing in Mexico - another unknown (not a racial/cultural slur).  I felt the same way about Toyota building in Cambridge, and Subaru in Indiana - at the beginning, they're unknowns, but over time, they can develop consumer trust. 

Quote
No word yet on whether it will imbue Corolla-like reliability.
I'm not a huge fan of the reliability of the products coming out of Toyota's Cambridge plant though, to be honest, and I think the "Corolla-like" reliability has faltered.  I think the new gen will bring that back up after Toyoda got all pis$y about Toyota's reputation, but there are some years that were allowed to fall too far.

In any event, I would have ranked:
1) Golf
2) Mazda
3) Kia
...because refinement matters most to me.

Great comparo, as always!

As a final thought, the 'cheapest' Golf I could live with is the 5-door, 1.8T auto, with cruise control, that is ~$24k with destination (everything but HST).  For that, I'm not sure I prefer this over an Impreza, which has AWD, sunroof, etc. in Sport guise.  As it always goes for me, VW = great engine and handling, 'meh' rest of car.  The Mazda is too polarizing (i.e. pisses me off with driver's seat and outward visibility), and the Kia isn't refined.  But that's because if I'm spending $30k on a car, I will nit-pick every little thing. ;D

Is Yarkony getting an early start on Movember? 
The flower-power rims don't help the cause, JY ;)  I'm excited to do Movember for the first time this year - in the past, work has expressly forbade it because courts don't like the 'unkept' look of facial hair.  Apparently, they relaxed a little in recent years and my bosses now allow it.  They pay me, so I do what I'm told.

Re: fuel economy, I know how hard you sirs drive on these comparos...I won't ruin any surprises, but 9.6L/100km isn't great given what ya'll got in some 6-cyl AWD powertrains in larger cars...

Offline OliverD

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #18 on: October 17, 2014, 10:40:17 am »
A comparison without any number achieved by the authors? Just EPA, CRA and manufacturers'?

We were working on one of our side-by-side spec tables, but ran out of gas last night... I've put in the basic prices/option and fuel consumption for now until that is ready.

I was surprised to see that the Kia was so close to the Golf and 3 on test day, considering its EPA number is significantly higher, though it did climb in the ensuing days, while the others dropped....

2015 Mazda3 Sport GT
Price as Tested: $30,490
Observed fuel consumption: 9.8 L/100 km
EPA rating: 9.0/6.7/8.1 L/100 km


2015 Volkswagen Golf 1.8 TSI Highline
Price as Tested: $33,585
Observed fuel consumption: 9.6 L/100 km
EPA rating: 9.4/6.5/8.1 L/100 km


2015 Kia Forte5 SX

Price as Tested: $29,980
Observed fuel consumption: 9.9 L/100 km
EPA rating: 11.2/8.1/9.8 L/100 km

one would have to REALLY want a hatch to ignore all the other amazing cars that can be had for $30+...for me it'd be an easy call - Ford Fusion Titanium or Honda Accord Touring. Perhaps...if I still wanted a hatchback, a RAV4 XLE w/ NAV or a Ford Escape Titanium...

no wonder why hatchbacks are a dying bread...

This is a matter of personal taste. There's nothing amazing about any of the cars you mentioned IMO.

Offline OliverD

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Re: Comparison Test: Compact Hatchbacks
« Reply #19 on: October 17, 2014, 10:42:10 am »
Quote
with only one option missing: an automatic transmission. That was a bold move, but in character for the brand known for the catchphrase I refuse to ever utter or type. (Side note: please move on, Mazda.) That’s right, manual transmission aficionados aren’t relegated to the lower trims or denied any of the options or engines (the 2.5L SkyActiv in this case) that shiftless shoppers can opt for. Bravo.
See, that disappoints me.  The transmission differences always end up being part of the equation, and Mazda was smart - they knew that an automotive journalist would prefer the stick.  It doesn't matter.  I love you guys and know that you compare things well, but there's just that visceral feeling of driving a stick that makes the competition a little loaded, making your job all the more difficult.  I can only imagine how distraught you are ;)

Or, they didn't have an automatic GT available.