Author Topic: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars  (Read 30755 times)

Offline tpl

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #40 on: August 05, 2014, 03:12:55 pm »
And for some buyers who just like FGCs the reliability is way down the list of features.
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Offline lebowski

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #41 on: August 05, 2014, 03:17:13 pm »
i wouldn't turn down any of these fun beasts... you know me though... for a fun 2nd/3rd car, my fun car would be a stripper wrangler... almost 8 grand less than the cheapest as tested price. base in soooo many ways, but a v6 and 4x4 convertible with 285 hp.


 :iagree: Such a good call. Tremendous value as a 2nd or 3rd car

BTW my cousin Bubba used to be a stripper wrangler out in Las Vegas - not an easy job :rofl2:

Thanks, I'll see myself out...

Offline tooscoops

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #42 on: August 05, 2014, 03:32:36 pm »
no need to leave! i actually had to go back and erase almost an identical comment! only i was referring to myself, not bubba.... tough job. i was covered in glitter and still can't stand the smell of vanilla.
i used to be addicted to soap, but i'm clean now

Offline naydek

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #43 on: August 05, 2014, 04:50:46 pm »
As a proud Hyundai Veloster Turbo owner (fully loaded is still under $30K) I wonder why was it not invited to the party? I chose it over Fiesta ST and Juke Nismo RS...

Offline Solstice2006

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #44 on: August 05, 2014, 05:26:11 pm »
As a proud Hyundai Veloster Turbo owner (fully loaded is still under $30K) I wonder why was it not invited to the party? I chose it over Fiesta ST and Juke Nismo RS...

That's an interesting point.  With the reviews, the specs, and the awards, I would figure the Fiesta would be more fun.  But I can't comment on the Veloster turbo, haven't driven that one yet.  That Fiesta sure is fun though...

Offline JacobBlack

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #45 on: August 05, 2014, 05:48:49 pm »
As a proud Hyundai Veloster Turbo owner (fully loaded is still under $30K) I wonder why was it not invited to the party? I chose it over Fiesta ST and Juke Nismo RS...

That's an interesting point.  With the reviews, the specs, and the awards, I would figure the Fiesta would be more fun.  But I can't comment on the Veloster turbo, haven't driven that one yet.  That Fiesta sure is fun though...

The Fiesta was a: not available and b: had been beaten by the mini already.

Offline Ex-airbalancer

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #46 on: August 05, 2014, 06:45:12 pm »
No crew cab  :o

Offline JacobBlack

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #47 on: August 05, 2014, 06:52:14 pm »
Cliff notes, as always.
Honda Civic Si
Love the seats, hate the dashboard, love the engine, but only after 4,000 rpm. The shifter is trick, the clutch pedal a good balance between firm and communicative. It handles better than I thought it was, but the styling still makes me yawn with boredom. Surprisingly, quite good for child-seat installation, the door opening is nice and wide. Better can than I expected, still not a favourite.
 
Mini Cooper S
Now that we’ve put it up against some of the others, I realize this has been dulled down more than I first thought. It’s fun, and has quick turn in for a car of its size – but it’s now “a car of its size”. It’s still playful as a puppy and the engine was a solid little unit in this company. I love the Mini Cooper S, but not sure if it stacks up here. Also, I’m livid that the fantastic styling has been ruined by that sick-baby yellow they painted it in. Gross. Child seat installation is frustrating due to the short door and lack of seat-movement in the front.
 
FR-S
Hot damn this thing is fun to drive! It’s so flickable, so quick-to-turn, so much fun. The engine needs more grunt, I’ll say that til the day I die, and tires make me sad in my soul – more tire, more power, more please. The seating position is comfortable and supportive, and there is excellent seat-of-the-pants feel on account of the tail and ground both being so close to – well, the seat of your pants. Wonderful car to drive, horrible tinny interior. The gap in the dashboard reminds me of my first tooth fairy visit.
Re child seats: Who the hell though it was okay to leave out a retainer of some sort on the passenger seat? Slide it forward, and it slides back. Forget that, and it slides back and chops out your achillles tendon while you wrestle the child seat in. At least the LATCH anchors are easily accessible.
 
GTI
Everyone likes this thing so much and for good reason. The interior is simple, elegant and user-friendly, but there is still some nifty “cool factor” to be had. The seats are made of tartan and win. The shift lever rocks. Installing child seats is a breeze  - thank you four doors, and flat seats!
 
Juke Nismo
Best seats of the entire test. I love these seats. I think in years to come people will buy Juke NISMO RSs from wreckers just for the seats. The steering wheel is the same, it’s the best, raciest, sexiest and most comfortable in the whole group. Those seats, and that wheel offer up so much promise.
Pity none of that promise is realized.
Despite four doors, child seat installation sucks, because the back doors are about 3 inches wide. .
 
MX-5
You know how Porsche gets away with having absolutely zero features and still costing a lot because they’re such wonderful cars? Mazda wants to do the same thing – and kind of achieves it. But with so much competition it won’t get away with this woefully under-equipped interior much longer. Of course, those are the thoughts you have in the parking lot. Once you’re on the road the only thoughts you have are, “OMG I love this car  this car is so good OMG what a fun car OMG off ramp!”
Child seats? LOL.
 
 
WRX
This engine gives me happy feelings in my ear holes. Vroom! Whoosh! Vroom! Roar! Yay! Handles like a dream too.
Probably the most practical of all of them but for the Golf’s hatch back.
I’m writing this up, so no need for more notes.

Offline Brendan McAleer

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #48 on: August 05, 2014, 07:59:48 pm »
Since I've driven all these too within the past year, I'll throw in my notes as well.

Cliff notes, as always.
Honda Civic Si
Love the seats, hate the dashboard, love the engine, but only after 4,000 rpm. The shifter is trick, the clutch pedal a good balance between firm and communicative. It handles better than I thought it was, but the styling still makes me yawn with boredom. Surprisingly, quite good for child-seat installation, the door opening is nice and wide. Better can than I expected, still not a favourite.

The biggest problem this car has is the old SIs, although I liked the HFP - and the HFP will spank an FR-S around the track. Until the FR-S puts decent tires on. The four-door is a neat proposition.


Mini Cooper S
Now that we’ve put it up against some of the others, I realize this has been dulled down more than I first thought. It’s fun, and has quick turn in for a car of its size – but it’s now “a car of its size”. It’s still playful as a puppy and the engine was a solid little unit in this company. I love the Mini Cooper S, but not sure if it stacks up here. Also, I’m livid that the fantastic styling has been ruined by that sick-baby yellow they painted it in. Gross. Child seat installation is frustrating due to the short door and lack of seat-movement in the front.


I did not like this car as much as you guys. Would take the rawer Fiesta by a country mile. Or a base Cooper. Will revise when JCW drops - and at least the pricing is better now.
 
FR-S
Hot damn this thing is fun to drive! It’s so flickable, so quick-to-turn, so much fun. The engine needs more grunt, I’ll say that til the day I die, and tires make me sad in my soul – more tire, more power, more please. The seating position is comfortable and supportive, and there is excellent seat-of-the-pants feel on account of the tail and ground both being so close to – well, the seat of your pants. Wonderful car to drive, horrible tinny interior. The gap in the dashboard reminds me of my first tooth fairy visit.
Re child seats: Who the hell though it was okay to leave out a retainer of some sort on the passenger seat? Slide it forward, and it slides back. Forget that, and it slides back and chops out your achillles tendon while you wrestle the child seat in. At least the LATCH anchors are easily accessible.

Needs 50 more lb/ft to be great. Rear-facing child seat lolololol - hope spouse fits in glovebox. My wife hated how noisy it was.


GTI
Everyone likes this thing so much and for good reason. The interior is simple, elegant and user-friendly, but there is still some nifty “cool factor” to be had. The seats are made of tartan and win. The shift lever rocks. Installing child seats is a breeze  - thank you four doors, and flat seats!
 

Only driven it 30-40 min, but this is not quite the car I drove in Napa somehow. Still good, DSG not too much of a compromise. Could be driven by an adult to pick up their mother in law without eliciting disapproving glare.


Juke Nismo
Best seats of the entire test. I love these seats. I think in years to come people will buy Juke NISMO RSs from wreckers just for the seats. The steering wheel is the same, it’s the best, raciest, sexiest and most comfortable in the whole group. Those seats, and that wheel offer up so much promise.
Pity none of that promise is realized.
Despite four doors, child seat installation sucks, because the back doors are about 3 inches wide.


Best seats ever. But the base fwd Juke is a better drive (not a great shifter, but basically Versa pricing. Reminds me of the RX-8 in terms of interior seating room. Rear facing child seat just barely. Fiesta is actually better.


MX-5
You know how Porsche gets away with having absolutely zero features and still costing a lot because they’re such wonderful cars? Mazda wants to do the same thing – and kind of achieves it. But with so much competition it won’t get away with this woefully under-equipped interior much longer. Of course, those are the thoughts you have in the parking lot. Once you’re on the road the only thoughts you have are, “OMG I love this car  this car is so good OMG what a fun car OMG off ramp!”
Child seats? LOL.


I don't trust that weight sensor. The old GTs you could turn the airbags off for a quick spin around the block with your kid. Costly, yes, but has one hell of a shallow depreciation curve. Really though, as a toy, wouldn't you just buy an older one? My father-in-law dailies one, and as he's retired, it works perfect.
 
WRX
This engine gives me happy feelings in my ear holes. Vroom! Whoosh! Vroom! Roar! Yay! Handles like a dream too.
Probably the most practical of all of them but for the Golf’s hatch back.
I’m writing this up, so no need for more notes.

So much more low end power than the STI. Rides like my '02 on konis and RCE progressive springs. Suction cup grip. Weirdly bassy thrum at idle - actually borderline irritating. Not as grown-up as the GTI. No hatchback makes me want to attack Subaru HQ with a sledgehammer. The rear doors open really wide for child seat stuff, and it's much roomier than the previous-gen (just eyeballing it). Good enough that I'll give up the Bugeye when the wagon comes. Not if. Don't say if. Stop it. NOOOOooooo....

Offline dirtyjeffer

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #49 on: August 05, 2014, 09:10:38 pm »
before i started reading, i guessed the winner would be either the GTI or the WRX (i figured it would go either way)...the GTi since it often seems to be a perennial favourite, or perhaps the WRX since it offers AWD and i thought perhaps a 4 door sedan would earn it bonus marks for "everyday livability"...i still miss my old Rabbit, and if i built a GTi, i'd pick the red one just like you have here, but i'd opt for the leather interior package...that said, that WRX is pretty sweet too.
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Offline wing

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #50 on: August 05, 2014, 09:42:53 pm »
I've driven a few FRS's now with better tires and other upgrades and IMO it's the only car in this list that has the perfect chassis and basis to be an amazing car with a few tweaks.  The rest, tweaks are just tweaks, the FRS tweaks turn it into a beast.

Love the car.

Offline Brendan McAleer

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #51 on: August 05, 2014, 10:37:38 pm »
I've driven a few FRS's now with better tires and other upgrades and IMO it's the only car in this list that has the perfect chassis and basis to be an amazing car with a few tweaks.  The rest, tweaks are just tweaks, the FRS tweaks turn it into a beast.

Love the car.

You know, I have a friend with a modified BR-Z (just suspension/tires stuff). I wonder if we could get that on the track out here vs. a stockish WRX and see which provides bang for buck. From what I've seen, an MX-5 on R-comps and a FR-S on Direzzas both did well enough on a "power" track to hang with much more powerful machinery.

However, both the GTI and the WRX have at least 50hp just sitting there for the cost of a COBB or similar (asked the WRX manager how much leeway they built in - this was the unofficial answer).

Offline rrocket

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #52 on: August 05, 2014, 10:44:38 pm »


However, both the GTI and the WRX have at least 50hp just sitting there for the cost of a COBB or similar (asked the WRX manager how much leeway they built in - this was the unofficial answer).

Only the WRX can actually use that extra 50WHP properly and enjoyably because of the AWD...
How fast is my 911?  Supras sh*t on on me all the time...in reverse..with blown turbos  :( ...

Offline Brendan McAleer

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #53 on: August 05, 2014, 10:49:56 pm »


However, both the GTI and the WRX have at least 50hp just sitting there for the cost of a COBB or similar (asked the WRX manager how much leeway they built in - this was the unofficial answer).

Only the WRX can actually use that extra 50WHP properly and enjoyably because of the AWD...

I'm not entirely sure. Yes with regards to the street, but the Mazdaspeed3 and the Focus ST do okay, and the GTI diff is pretty good (EDIT: fake diff, I know). Not in corners, admittedly, but a careful driver could work it out, unwinding at apex, etc. I sort of echo the TG assessment that 250hp is the cap for FWD, so in or around there. STI chassis could easily handle 400+hp with effectively no other suspension adds. Maybe DBA rotors and more aggressive pads all round.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2014, 10:52:21 pm by Brendan McAleer »

Offline wing

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #54 on: August 05, 2014, 10:56:37 pm »
FRS modified kills a stock WRX on the track.  I drove the stock WRX on the track, it surprisingly turned well, but the tires started to fall off after just 1 lap and the brakes went to dust in 2.  So ummm yeah. 

Stock cars can't lap for the most part.  But took a stock FRS on track and it can go all day, add sticky tires and even better.

Offline Brendan McAleer

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #55 on: August 05, 2014, 11:07:03 pm »
FRS modified kills a stock WRX on the track.  I drove the stock WRX on the track, it surprisingly turned well, but the tires started to fall off after just 1 lap and the brakes went to dust in 2.  So ummm yeah. 

Stock cars can't lap for the most part.  But took a stock FRS on track and it can go all day, add sticky tires and even better.

Oh yeah, the WRX brakes aren't very good. Mind you, the tracked FR-S I saw needed better fronts (according to the owner, and Mission is a brake-eater). I think it depends on the track - PIR would favour a momentum car like the MX5/FRS. On the street, the WRX would be quicker point-to-point because you don't go 10/10ths out there, and the extra torque is a huge benefit.

Offline Solstice2006

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #56 on: August 06, 2014, 12:27:38 am »
As a proud Hyundai Veloster Turbo owner (fully loaded is still under $30K) I wonder why was it not invited to the party? I chose it over Fiesta ST and Juke Nismo RS...

That's an interesting point.  With the reviews, the specs, and the awards, I would figure the Fiesta would be more fun.  But I can't comment on the Veloster turbo, haven't driven that one yet.  That Fiesta sure is fun though...

The Fiesta was a: not available and b: had been beaten by the mini already.


Jacob,  A: I read the Fiesta was not available.  In my statement, I was replying to the authors comment with his choice of the Veloster over the Fiesta.   And B: I don't like Mini's, if I wanted a cheap BMW, I would just buy an older one, and have a car that looked decent. 

Offline mixmanmash

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #57 on: August 06, 2014, 08:37:54 am »
Nice article.  Doesn't the MX-5 have a 2.0L MZR engine?  The article states a 1.6L which IIRC was in the first gen cars.

Offline bombastic

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #58 on: August 06, 2014, 08:58:26 am »
Excellent review!!! A well deserved win for GTI. The best all round car of the bunch.
Bombastic

Offline JacobBlack

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Re: Comparison Test: Affordable Everyday Fun Cars
« Reply #59 on: August 06, 2014, 09:27:23 am »
Nice article.  Doesn't the MX-5 have a 2.0L MZR engine?  The article states a 1.6L which IIRC was in the first gen cars.

Oh goddamnit we muffed that one. JY owes a carton for writing it, I owe a six pack for missing it in the sub-edit.
Good catch Mix.