Topic: Winter Driving Tips : Collection

[sailor723]

I agree with Snowy and tpl; the best suggestion is to just stay home when the weather is truly terrible. I'm typically asked to come along on our winter testing programs as a driver, so I don't always get a choice. It's always an interesting experience to head into northern Quebec in a convoy of vehicles where 2-3 drivers are Korean engineers who may have never driven in snow before. I'm tasked with running sweep to keep speed in check, yelling over the radio as required.

If you're forced to drive in bad weather, there are two general rules I find more important than any other:

1) Speed appropriate for conditions. Evaluate visibility and traction (both current and predicted), manage speed accordingly. If visibility is truly poor, DO NOT STOP ON THE HIGHWAY. Keep moving, even if it's slowly. Last year I saw what happens when you stop in white-out conditions first-hand, witnessing 30+ vehicles pile into one another on the opposite side of the 401 during February's winter storm.

2) Maintain an appropriate following distance. Gauge how long braking distances will be, and keep other vehicles out of that envelope.

It's not rocket science.

From those old pics from the Korean 'police action'   Korea gets plenty of snow and cold weather....which does not, of course, mean that those engineers have ever had to drive in snow.

I wondered that as well. Is there that much difference in climate between North Korea and the south? (Frozen Chosin and all that)

[Patrick_D1]

I agree with Snowy and tpl; the best suggestion is to just stay home when the weather is truly terrible. I'm typically asked to come along on our winter testing programs as a driver, so I don't always get a choice. It's always an interesting experience to head into northern Quebec in a convoy of vehicles where 2-3 drivers are Korean engineers who may have never driven in snow before. I'm tasked with running sweep to keep speed in check, yelling over the radio as required.

If you're forced to drive in bad weather, there are two general rules I find more important than any other:

1) Speed appropriate for conditions. Evaluate visibility and traction (both current and predicted), manage speed accordingly. If visibility is truly poor, DO NOT STOP ON THE HIGHWAY. Keep moving, even if it's slowly. Last year I saw what happens when you stop in white-out conditions first-hand, witnessing 30+ vehicles pile into one another on the opposite side of the 401 during February's winter storm.

2) Maintain an appropriate following distance. Gauge how long braking distances will be, and keep other vehicles out of that envelope.

It's not rocket science.

From those old pics from the Korean 'police action'   Korea gets plenty of snow and cold weather....which does not, of course, mean that those engineers have ever had to drive in snow.

I wondered that as well. Is there that much difference in climate between North Korea and the south? (Frozen Chosin and all that)

They definitely get snow, but in my experience (however anecdotal), few of my colleagues from Korea have ever driven in it.

On our winter test we cover 2,500+ km in a week through terrible conditions, so we each partner up with a co-driver. My first year, before my co-driver took the wheel, I asked him if he'd ever driven in snow. Despite the language barrier, I deciphered this response:

Engineer: "Once, when I was in the military, I saw lots of snow. Three centimetres."

Me: "Sorry, do you mean 30 centimetres?"

Engineer: "No, 3."

Me: "Did you drive in it?"

Engineer: "I've driven in rain."

Since then on I've never surrendered the driver's seat on a winter test.

[mmret]

Go to an empty parking lot an play "Formula Drift".  Good fun..and good practice.   

I did that...when I lived in Ottawa. There was a parking lot that my apartment overlooked, and it was totally deserted at night, so I went there and tooled about in the TSX.


I did notice that after a few times, a security car started showing up every so often. Thankfully I noticed said car from the safety and comfort of my apartment.

[X-Traction]

Don't rely on momentum to get up a hill if there's a good chance you won't make it.  Your traction may not be enough to keep you from sliding back down and appearing in funny YouTube videos.

Don't put your 4wd in locked mode on the highway.

Ive been in a lot of situations where this was requiered....why do you say not to??

You would be familiar with the "crow-hopping" problem on 4wd's on bare pavement with any portion of the drivetrain in lock mode.  Any lock mode forces at least two wheels to turn at the same rate.  We know that cornering requires wheels to turn at different rates.  So if you're cornering with a 4wd in locked mode on ice or snow, you won't get crow-hopping because some wheel or wheels are going to be turning at a different rate than their speed across the ground. In other words, they will be sliding a bit.  The trouble with sliding a bit is that you've lost that ideal coefficient of friction that a freely turning wheel has.  As soon as you have one or more wheels that are slipping at the same time as you're cornering with enough angle and speed to generate G forces, you are at high risk of losing control.

Exactly the same forces that cause crow-hopping on dry pavement will cause slippage on slippery surfaces.  I believe this is the main cause of all those suv's upside down in ditches on the first corner when it snows on the highways.  Locked modes are only for slow-speed driving on snow/ice/gravel/sand.  I hope this makes sense to you because despite the automotive press having nothing to say about it, it makes perfect sense to me.

[RX7heaven]

Driving downhill in a front wheel drive vehicle while off the gas can put engine braking force on the front wheels. Would putting it in neutral help if you started to lose control? Out here on the left coast we are usually close to zero when it snows and this seems more slippery than snow in colder temperatures. Warm your car up while it is locked or with an anti theft device on it. Interior car heaters that come on a bit before you drive off are nice.

[dkaz]

Don't selectable 4WDs have a 4H and 4L mode?

And with proper tires, getting going again from a stop up a hill is possible. Before with all season tires, I had to risk getting into an accident by blowing through stop signs to make it up hill. Winter tires enabled me to safely come to a complete stop up hill.

[Angry Chicken]

Here in Ottawa, a local driving school did a spot on TV where they said that you must absolutely put the car in neutral when you feel the car slipping on a corner.  I know that that piece of advice has been around since practically the advent of the automobile, but is this still good advice given modern electronic nannys like traction control, ABS, Electronic Stability Program (ESP), torque-vectoring, etc....?  I think better advice would be to ease your foot off the gas and continue to gently steer as required and wait while the car corrects itself. 

[wing]

Neutral still works as it removes power from the wheels and helps them turn.  Not really for stopping it's more for turning

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

[quadzilla]

I know I can easily put my car into neutral but I wonder if it would go back in gear. I have the DSG and you need your foot to be on the brake to get into gear, no idea what would happen while at speed. Anybody with one willing to try?

[wing]

Try it when you are stopped.  Do you need to put your foot on the brake from neutral to drive?

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

[tpl]

I know I can easily put my car into neutral but I wonder if it would go back in gear. I have the DSG and you need your foot to be on the brake to get into gear, no idea what would happen while at speed. Anybody with one willing to try?

Deep in the small print in the owners manual IIRC they do NOT recommend changing into neutral AND BACK INTO GEAR while moving and I can understand that. You'd need some extra logic in the mechatronic to compute what gear you'd have to be in based on the output shaft speed. The device I bet assumes that it only has to care about the input shaft.  To complicate matters you would have to do some manual rev matching ( which you'd do automatically in a MT car but automatic drivers just don't have the brain software running while they drive  ) which would probably confuse the hell out of the mechatronic.

Certainly with my 2008 DSG you had to touch the brakes to go from neutral to drive even while stopped ( leaving a car wash for instance)

[quadzilla]

Have to agree with TPL about putting it back into gear at speed. Also, I do have to touch the brakes when not moving to put it into gear. The car will lock out and movement past Neutral until you put your foot on the brake. The odd time I can get into gear without the brake but its usually when going from R to D and a very small window.

[tpl]

A DSG that allowed all this would be...not a (semi) automatic gearbox...but a motorcycle gearbox. With a human brain computer to operate the clutch and the gearchange.  Does anyone make a DSG-like cycle gearbox?   I imagine that BMW might have tried it.

[tortoise]

In that case what about grabbing a great or two higher. That will lessen the engine braking effect.

[Rupert]

Like you have the presence of mind to do the gear things when in difficulty...yeah right. I think I would keep my mind on where I was going and not look at what I was aiming to miss..as a last resort...look at where to go to miss it. Again hard to remember.

When the traffic is coming to a stop, leave extra room behind the car ahead when stopped...plenty of it. Give yourself time to look in the rear view mirror and check if the guy behind is having difficulty in stopping behind you...if this is the case you can at least move up into the space you have left to give him more distance. When all is sanguine behind you can slowly move up.

Yeah...don't go out...keep a winter supply of frozen food, including milk and bread in a chest freezer in your house. Good to buy in store specials and save anyway.

Sent from my computer room in my pyjamas.

[tenpenny]

Like you have the presence of mind to do the gear things when in difficulty...yeah right.

I've done exactly that, pop it into neutral while controlling the vehicle.

If you can't control your car, you shouldn't be driving.

[Fobroader]

Like you have the presence of mind to do the gear things when in difficulty...yeah right. Keep your mind on where you are going and don't look at what you are aiming to miss..as a last resort...look at where to go to miss it. Again hard to remember.

When the traffic is coming to a stop, leave extra room behind the car ahead when stopped...plenty of it. Give yourself time to look in the rear view mirror and check if the guy behind is having difficulty in stopping behind you...if this is the case you can at least move up into the space you have left to give him more distance. When all is sanguine behind you can slowly move up.

Yeah...don't go out...keep a winter supply of frozen food, including milk and bread in a chest freezer in your house. Good to buy in store specials and save anyway.

Sent from my computer room in my pyjamas.

So when you are "in difficulty" as you say, is a person just supposed to cover their eyes and yell for momma.......thats kind of a defeatist attitude. If you are sliding off the road, into someone, picking up unwanted speed down an icy hill.....dont you think that one should try to rectify the situation instead of just yelling"TAKE ME BABY JEBUS!!!"

[Rupert]

Well, I thought that concentrating on driving to miss obstacles  would be the priority over shifting in these conditions.
Sure if you have lots of time to do these things on a prepared pad. Mostly stuff happens in a hurry and there is probably not enough time to do gearing down or out. I think that any one would be proud of having my driving record anyway.

[tenpenny]

If you are sliding off the road, into someone, picking up unwanted speed down an icy hill.....dont you think that one should try to rectify the situation instead of just yelling"TAKE ME BABY JEBUS!!!"

When I heard that country song, 'Jesus Take the Wheel', co-written by Gordie Sampson, I wondered if it was meant seriously or very ironically.  Still wonder.

[tenpenny]

Sure if you have lots of time to do these things on a prepared pad. Mostly stuff happens in a hurry and there is probably not enough time to do gearing down or out.

Yep, stuff happens in a hurry.  That's why you learn to drive, so you react properly when needed to.  That's why people practice stuff. So that it comes naturally when push comes to shove.

If you're not interested in learning how to drive, don't bother learning.  Whatever.  Namecalling is always welcome, by the way.