Author Topic: Travel Trailers  (Read 63269 times)

Offline rrocket

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #260 on: March 10, 2019, 12:43:06 pm »


Now this looks like a good time.



IQ and I have camped at various racetracks many times.


How fast is my 911?  Supras sh*t on on me all the time...in reverse..with blown turbos  :( ...

Offline Great_Big_Abyss

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #261 on: March 13, 2019, 11:11:18 am »
My wife fell in love with the Coachmen APEX Nano's at the Winnipeg RV show.  They are a smaller (7' wide, vs. usual 8' wide, and a lower height), lighter trailer (under 4000lbs for the largest model, the 208BHS)

http://www.coachmenrv.com/travel-trailers/apex-nano/208BHS/4011
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M57GtXweTI0

Pricewise, they are similar (mid to high twenties) to a standard size 26-27', but they probably have a few more features/options/build quality, because they are smaller. 

I like them because they would be easier to tow than a full size 26' travel trailer.  At 4000lbs, the Tundra wouldn't even really notice that it's back there, and I would save a bit of money on not having to buy a weight distributing hitch (Toyota recommends a WDH on 6000lbs+ trailer), and, at 7' wide, I wouldn't need tow mirrors.  More importantly, the fuel bill would be less than if we bought a larger trailer. 

Technically, this trailer meets all our requirements:  It's got a large queen bed up front, large-ish bunks at the back, a tub for washing the kid (a requirement for my wife), and a dinette slide to open up floor space inside. 

At the same time, at 4000lbs, it makes me wonder why I bought a giant Tundra, when something like a Honda Pilot or Highlander would have technically done the job on something this small.  But then I give my truck the beans on an on-ramp, hear that engine howl, and immediately remember why I'm glad I chose something with a V8.

Plus, I would have no problem pulling this with the truck all the way to the Rockies.  The truck would have PLENTY of reserve power for those long, steep grades. 

Offline dkaz

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #262 on: March 13, 2019, 11:43:22 am »
My wife fell in love with the Coachmen APEX Nano's at the Winnipeg RV show.  They are a smaller (7' wide, vs. usual 8' wide, and a lower height), lighter trailer (under 4000lbs for the largest model, the 208BHS)

http://www.coachmenrv.com/travel-trailers/apex-nano/208BHS/4011
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M57GtXweTI0

Pricewise, they are similar (mid to high twenties) to a standard size 26-27', but they probably have a few more features/options/build quality, because they are smaller. 

I like them because they would be easier to tow than a full size 26' travel trailer.  At 4000lbs, the Tundra wouldn't even really notice that it's back there, and I would save a bit of money on not having to buy a weight distributing hitch (Toyota recommends a WDH on 6000lbs+ trailer), and, at 7' wide, I wouldn't need tow mirrors.  More importantly, the fuel bill would be less than if we bought a larger trailer. 

Technically, this trailer meets all our requirements:  It's got a large queen bed up front, large-ish bunks at the back, a tub for washing the kid (a requirement for my wife), and a dinette slide to open up floor space inside. 

At the same time, at 4000lbs, it makes me wonder why I bought a giant Tundra, when something like a Honda Pilot or Highlander would have technically done the job on something this small.  But then I give my truck the beans on an on-ramp, hear that engine howl, and immediately remember why I'm glad I chose something with a V8.

Plus, I would have no problem pulling this with the truck all the way to the Rockies.  The truck would have PLENTY of reserve power for those long, steep grades.

Saw that at the RV show, nice plan. I just see slide outs as another potential point of failure and also increases weight. One thing to consider, can you load the fridge without pulling the slideout out? I suspect you can just squeeze by but it is a common complaint among people with slideouts. What's the weight limit of the top bunk? It'll should be minimum 250 lb, but Jayco set the standard at 600 lb which is an absurd number but it feels good they at least designed it for that much.

The GVWR is still within Toyota's guide, but most would recommend it if the weight of the trailer is more than half the weight of your vehicle. My WDH has built in sway control too. And I bought my 26' for the high teens thank you very much.

Offline Fobroader

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #263 on: March 13, 2019, 11:44:46 am »
Slide outs are fantastic....we have one on our trailer but I wish it had more. What a great idea to expand space once you are parked.
Lighten up Francis.....

Offline Great_Big_Abyss

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #264 on: March 13, 2019, 12:00:05 pm »
My wife fell in love with the Coachmen APEX Nano's at the Winnipeg RV show.  They are a smaller (7' wide, vs. usual 8' wide, and a lower height), lighter trailer (under 4000lbs for the largest model, the 208BHS)

http://www.coachmenrv.com/travel-trailers/apex-nano/208BHS/4011
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M57GtXweTI0

Pricewise, they are similar (mid to high twenties) to a standard size 26-27', but they probably have a few more features/options/build quality, because they are smaller. 

I like them because they would be easier to tow than a full size 26' travel trailer.  At 4000lbs, the Tundra wouldn't even really notice that it's back there, and I would save a bit of money on not having to buy a weight distributing hitch (Toyota recommends a WDH on 6000lbs+ trailer), and, at 7' wide, I wouldn't need tow mirrors.  More importantly, the fuel bill would be less than if we bought a larger trailer. 

Technically, this trailer meets all our requirements:  It's got a large queen bed up front, large-ish bunks at the back, a tub for washing the kid (a requirement for my wife), and a dinette slide to open up floor space inside. 

At the same time, at 4000lbs, it makes me wonder why I bought a giant Tundra, when something like a Honda Pilot or Highlander would have technically done the job on something this small.  But then I give my truck the beans on an on-ramp, hear that engine howl, and immediately remember why I'm glad I chose something with a V8.

Plus, I would have no problem pulling this with the truck all the way to the Rockies.  The truck would have PLENTY of reserve power for those long, steep grades.

Yes, the fridge can be opened with the slideout closed. 

Saw that at the RV show, nice plan. I just see slide outs as another potential point of failure and also increases weight. One thing to consider, can you load the fridge without pulling the slideout out? I suspect you can just squeeze by but it is a common complaint among people with slideouts. What's the weight limit of the top bunk? It'll should be minimum 250 lb, but Jayco set the standard at 600 lb which is an absurd number but it feels good they at least designed it for that much.

The GVWR is still within Toyota's guide, but most would recommend it if the weight of the trailer is more than half the weight of your vehicle. My WDH has built in sway control too. And I bought my 26' for the high teens thank you very much.

I would pull it the first few times with just a weight bearing hitch (normal), see how the truck squats/handles, and then make a decision after on whether I'd want to go with a WDH hitch.  Answer is probably, yes, because I like to overdo things somewhat. 
Because my truck is equipped with an integrated brake controller, it has trailer sway control baked in already. 

High teens for your 26' trailer is a fantastic price, and that would likely sway me towards something like what you have. 
« Last Edit: March 13, 2019, 12:03:32 pm by Great_Big_Abyss »

Offline dkaz

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #265 on: March 13, 2019, 12:17:58 pm »
Yes, the fridge can be opened with the slideout closed. 

I would pull it the first few times with just a weight bearing hitch (normal), see how the truck squats/handles, and then make a decision after on whether I'd want to go with a WDH hitch.  Answer is probably, yes, because I like to overdo things somewhat. 
Because my truck is equipped with an integrated brake controller, it has trailer sway control baked in already. 

High teens for your 26' trailer is a fantastic price, and that would likely sway me towards something like what you have. 

The only thing my layout is missing is the outdoor kitchen. I was looking at a Jayco 22 footer non slide out that would've lost the interior couch but gained an outdoor kitchen for the same price, but at the end of the day we wanted somewhere to hang out if it was raining out.

Offline Solstice2006

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #266 on: March 13, 2019, 08:20:29 pm »
My wife fell in love with the Coachmen APEX Nano's at the Winnipeg RV show.  They are a smaller (7' wide, vs. usual 8' wide, and a lower height), lighter trailer (under 4000lbs for the largest model, the 208BHS)

http://www.coachmenrv.com/travel-trailers/apex-nano/208BHS/4011
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M57GtXweTI0

Pricewise, they are similar (mid to high twenties) to a standard size 26-27', but they probably have a few more features/options/build quality, because they are smaller. 

I like them because they would be easier to tow than a full size 26' travel trailer.  At 4000lbs, the Tundra wouldn't even really notice that it's back there, and I would save a bit of money on not having to buy a weight distributing hitch (Toyota recommends a WDH on 6000lbs+ trailer), and, at 7' wide, I wouldn't need tow mirrors.  More importantly, the fuel bill would be less than if we bought a larger trailer. 

Technically, this trailer meets all our requirements:  It's got a large queen bed up front, large-ish bunks at the back, a tub for washing the kid (a requirement for my wife), and a dinette slide to open up floor space inside. 

At the same time, at 4000lbs, it makes me wonder why I bought a giant Tundra, when something like a Honda Pilot or Highlander would have technically done the job on something this small.  But then I give my truck the beans on an on-ramp, hear that engine howl, and immediately remember why I'm glad I chose something with a V8.

Plus, I would have no problem pulling this with the truck all the way to the Rockies.  The truck would have PLENTY of reserve power for those long, steep grades.

With the MX-5 passing you on the shoulder of that ramp!   ;D

Offline bridgecity

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #267 on: March 13, 2019, 08:30:11 pm »
For those of you purchasing trailers, buy the biggest one you can afford. I know bigger inst always better, but if you’re towing a trailer down the highway, length won’t make much difference in mpg. You might notice a slight difference with a narrower trailer but you’ll appreciate the space inside.

I purchased two smaller trailers before our current 31’er.  Should have just went big to begin with. GBA, you started with a pop up. Just buy a 8’ wide 30’er and be done with it.  :)
Quality is never an accident; it is always the result of high intention, sincere effort, intelligent direction, and skillful execution; it represents the wise choice of many alternatives.

Offline rrocket

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #268 on: March 13, 2019, 08:43:07 pm »
I forgot to tell you guys...I called about that trailer IQ liked....

12-18 month wait!   :o

Offline Solstice2006

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #269 on: March 13, 2019, 08:49:43 pm »
I forgot to tell you guys...I called about that trailer IQ liked....

12-18 month wait!   :o

So did you $1000 deposit?

Offline rrocket

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #270 on: March 13, 2019, 08:50:01 pm »
I forgot to tell you guys...I called about that trailer IQ liked....

12-18 month wait!   :o

So did you $1000 deposit?

No

Offline Great_Big_Abyss

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #271 on: March 13, 2019, 11:22:58 pm »
Actually, I found DKaz's exact model of Avenger, even down to the optional sink tile backsplash and spray faucet.  It's listed at $22k.  That tempts me more than those smaller units.

https://www.transconatrailers.com/inventory/2019-avenger-ati-by-prime-time-manufacturing-26-bb-winnipeg-mb-r2j-0h2-2444171i

Offline dkaz

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #272 on: March 14, 2019, 12:59:23 am »
Actually, I found DKaz's exact model of Avenger, even down to the optional sink tile backsplash and spray faucet.  It's listed at $22k.  That tempts me more than those smaller units.

https://www.transconatrailers.com/inventory/2019-avenger-ati-by-prime-time-manufacturing-26-bb-winnipeg-mb-r2j-0h2-2444171i

Try to get it down to $19k. I did buy last year’s model though. I think the 19 has one improvement, enclosed underbelly.

Jayco has a similar model at a similar price, with some improvements. They use only plywood for one, their top bunk is good for 600 lb vs. 250 on the Avenger. It also comes with Goodyear Endurance tires and a longer 2 year warranty. I went with Avenger because the dealer seemed a lot better. We also liked the nicer kitchen and interior and there’s a 25 year warranty on the floor structure (first thing to rot on almost every R.V.), plus from what I hear from people, the stuff these manufacturers churn out are the same quality anyway and there are happy owners of the Avenger model up to 4 years old.

https://www.jayco.com/tools/archive/2018-jay-flight-slx/264bh/

Videos to compare:
Primetime Avenger ATI 26BB https://youtu.be/KqnqntTFk3U
Jayco Jay Flight SLX8 264BH https://youtu.be/pi8pXd873dk

One thing to consider is that our units are what’s called stick and tin vs. the more expensive sandwiched aluminum in the Coachmen you were looking at. Some people claim that sandwich aluminum holds up a lot better especially if you drive it on rough roads for extended periods. Lots of people have stick and tin units though.

I think we’ll appreciate the space but keep in mind that our medium size units have eliminated about a quarter of the available camp sites, although most of those don’t have power anyway. A 20 footer will fit more sites.

Offline Great_Big_Abyss

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #273 on: March 14, 2019, 09:46:39 am »
^^^So, you both bring up some good points, and this is what I'm having an issue with.  FWIW, we are nowhere near buying (more financial than anything else), but are still shopping around so that we can nail down exactly what we want, and how much it will cost, for when we ARE ready to buy. 

So, right now, it's 'kind of' between two different types of trailers.  The smaller, 7'-wide trailers, like the Apex Nano 208BHS: http://www.coachmenrv.com/travel-trailers/apex-nano/208BHS/4011, and larger, 8'-wide trailers, like the Avenger ATI 26BB: https://www.generalrv.com/product-prime-time-rv/avenger-ati-travel-trailer/26bb

SO, we have been doing pop-up camping for the last few years.  We LOVE our pop-up, and one of the features I like most about it is that we can fit it in just about any site we care to.  If we want that small river-front or lake-front site, it's not a problem.  We also do a fair bit of battery camping - that is sites that don't have power.  A pop-up is perfect for this, as really the only thing you need to run are lights, and occasionally the furnace if its really cold at night.  A battery and a solar panel are plenty enough to do a week of battery camping.  At this point, I am leaning towards the smaller camper, for a number of reasons:

A)  It is smaller, and therefore easier to fit into tight camping sites.  I'm pretty sure if I could fit my pop up (which is 20' long when unfolded, and 7'-wide), I could pretty much fit the little Apex Nano.

B)  The Apex Nano seems well setup for battery camping.  The small interior space would lend well to keeping it warm when we need to kick on the furnace.  The higher amperage furnace fan is what will drain a battery overnight, and the larger the space you're heating, the more the fan will run.  Interior volume of the Apex Nano would be similar to my popup, but with a higher R-value, as heat wouldn't be escaping through tent-walls.  For the warmer days, it has a lot of window area, compared to the volume of the trailer, and the two ceiling vents have 12v fans installed to help circulate air when you can't have AC running (because your site doesn't have power)

C)  I think there would be a marked difference between pulling a 7'-wide, lower profile trailer, and an 8'-wide, tall monstrosity like the Avenger.  I'm not only talking about frontal area, but also side profile, which is one of the leading contributors to sway.  I'd like to pull a trailer across the continent if possible, and a large trailer would just make it harder.  Harder on fuel, and harder on the driver, as I would need to work harder to keep the trailer under control, see around it, etc.  If we went with the Avenger, I would be tempted to keep our pop-up, and use it for the longer trips, relegating the Avenger to half-day drives around Winnipeg at the most, whereas with the Apex, I could sell the pop-up, and take the Apex on longer drives. 

D)  Is interior space really all that important?  Currently when we camp, we spend most of our time outside.  We cook outside (under the awning, so I can cook when its raining), eat outside (unless it's raining, but even then - we have a dining tent), and generally just hang out outside.  If it's really miserable, (cold/rainy), the wife and kids will retreat inside the camper with the furnace on and watch movies/play games, but I generally like to sit outside and watch the rain from the shelter of the awning.  That being said, last year we didn't have a single day of rain while we were camping.  It rained at night sometimes, but never during the day.  So, the trailer is really only there to store our clothes and food, provide sleeping accomodations, and act as somewhere to shelter if its really miserable out.  BONUS POINTS:  The APEX Nano has a partial exterior kitchen, facilitating my outside cooking mission. 

E)  Again, related to space:  My stepson turns 18 in June.  My wife has come out and said that she's not going to force him to come camping with us.  If he wants to come, he can come, but he doesn't have to anymore.  Knowing his personality, I think he will opt to stay home, especially as he gets older and starts to enjoy a little more independence.  This means that I foresee most of our camping trips just being my wife, daughter, and I.  Do we really need a behemoth trailer if its only the three of us?  If my daughter decides she wants to bring a friend camping with her for the weekend, well, we'll have the extra bunk.  And if my stepson is with us, the dinette still turns into a bunk. 

F)  Build Quality.  The Apex Nano is $8 000 more expensive than the Avenger.  I feel like it is built to a higher quality.  The construction is the more expensive sandwich construction.  It has a one-piece end-cap with an integrated windshield.  I feel like the interior materials are of a higher quality than the Avenger, meaning the parts you don't see (like the roof) are likely better quality as well. 

G)  The one detriment is that the Apex Nano is more expensive than a trailer like the Avenger.  BUT, in point C, I argued that if buying the Apex Nano, I wouldn't have to keep my pop-up trailer.  I think with the improvements and repairs that I've made to it, I could easily get $5000 from my pop-up, which would go a LONG way towards closing the price gap between the two trailers. 
« Last Edit: March 14, 2019, 09:52:48 am by Great_Big_Abyss »

Offline ktm525

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #274 on: March 14, 2019, 10:31:08 am »
Get the Nano. Point D :iagree:

Your kid made it to 18 camping? Most bail 5 years earlier lol.

Offline Great_Big_Abyss

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #275 on: March 14, 2019, 10:39:00 am »
Get the Nano. Point D :iagree:

Your kid made it to 18 camping? Most bail 5 years earlier lol.

He never had a choice.

Offline Great_Big_Abyss

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #276 on: March 14, 2019, 10:41:04 am »
Here is a nice video from the manufacturer that talks about build quality. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUSqbOQz3hA


OOOH, Look at this one:  A 24' Narrow Body!!  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zgJ5j0BB268

Me Likey!!!
« Last Edit: March 14, 2019, 10:49:40 am by Great_Big_Abyss »

Offline Solstice2006

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #277 on: March 14, 2019, 11:17:30 am »
You use battery power to run the furnace?  The propane is much more efficient.  When we go camping in October (thanksgiving weekend).  Furnace runs sometimes, we use 1/4 tank over 3 nights.  Same as the fridge. 

Offline Great_Big_Abyss

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #278 on: March 14, 2019, 11:45:48 am »
You use battery power to run the furnace?  The propane is much more efficient.  When we go camping in October (thanksgiving weekend).  Furnace runs sometimes, we use 1/4 tank over 3 nights.  Same as the fridge.

Your furnace (and mine) uses both electricity and propane.  Electricity to power the fan, and propane to heat.  When you're plugged in, you're not at all concerned about electricity use, only with propane use, so that's probably why you've never thought about it.

But when you're battery camping, electricity is a finite resource, so you become very aware of amperage draw, and the furnace fan is a the biggest one (outside of using an inverter to change 12v to 120v...that would only work if you have a HUGE battery bank, though).

It's one of the main reasons I converted all the trailer lights to LED; we don't have to ration their use when battery camping, because they hardly draw any amps. 
« Last Edit: March 14, 2019, 11:50:30 am by Great_Big_Abyss »

Offline Solstice2006

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Re: Travel Trailers
« Reply #279 on: March 14, 2019, 11:49:51 am »
You use battery power to run the furnace?  The propane is much more efficient.  When we go camping in October (thanksgiving weekend).  Furnace runs sometimes, we use 1/4 tank over 3 nights.  Same as the fridge.

Both Battery and propane.  Battery to run the blower fan, and propane to heat.  Out of all the items in the trailer that consumes 12v electricity, the furnace fan uses the most amps.  The only other thing I have are the lights, which I've converted to LED, so they hardly use any amps at all.

Same here.  Guess I never realized the fan uses the battery.  Since I have never had a problem.  Never noticed.  But it makes sense.