Topic: First Drive: 2014 Toyota Corolla

[KD]

As I said, not EVERYONE can afford to keep a second vehicle (be it space or price).
The fear I am saying is that each household being restricted to ONE vehicle... and it may as well be a Corolla.
Could you live with that?

No, but almost everyone could.  And it's always been like that.  There's never been a "do it all" vehicle that appeals to enthusiasts.

Everyone could?
Cost of the vehicle, Insurance, space, not everyone has a double-attached garage and not everyone makes $100k household income.

There's never a "do it all" vehicle, but there are compromises vehicles.
Like the Subaru STi.  Perfect family sedan (for enthusiasts) ?
 
I think I am thankful that I had the RX-8 when I did, I may not see another chance to get another RWD manual sports car.

All of the people we know have a minimum of 2 cars per household and have at least a double garage.  While you Toronto types might be happy living in a 300sq ft apartment on the 44th floor.....the ROC lives in houses.

Sent from my Galaxy S3

We have two cars ( but both just 4 cyl hatchbacks) and a small single garage  attached to a house.   Everyone we know has two cars. Including a single person. One couple has 4 cars, one fancy coupe, one winter AWD and two sports cars.

We could live with just the Fit...but why should we.  Somebody has to help use all the resources before the greenies and the back to the stone age people take over.

Why does a single person have two cars? The only scenario I can see is that one is a commuter and one is for track day... (IMHO the Corolla makes the perfect commuter car).

Don't fear the "greenies"... fear actually running out of the stuff that makes the modern western world go round. Better hope we innovate our way out of the corner we have ourselves backed into right now.

That person keeps horses and donkeys so one "car" is an enormous pickup for getting hay and pulling a trailer thingy sometimes. The other is a small efficient hatchback.

We won't run out of any resources in the remainder  of my lifetime...but there are a gang of people who want us to stop using them...or if you prefer, want us to have a low energy lifestyle in the western world and travel on buses and not fly when we wish...you know who I mean...people who hold climate conferences in Bali.  The higher purpose people who are absolutely sure that they know best. The people who  flit off the the USA for instant medical care while the rest queue for example.

Those two cars do make perfect sense in that case.

No, I'm not sure who those people are. Not real environmentalists anyways. Sounds more like corporate types and politicians. Maybe they can fly away for their conference and stay there for all of the good they are doing.

One thing is for sure... either we're going to need to dream up some new ways to continue our lifestyle or eventually it will be taken away from us due to scarcity. Maybe not in your lifetime but legacy is important...

The thing that scares me the most is some of the bottom-feeder technologies being employed to eke out fuel from sensitive areas!  The latest is this fracking nonsense where huge amounts of pressurized water and toxic chemicals are injected into the ground to remove whatever fuel is trapped in the rock fissures in the soil substrate and polluting the water table as a result.  Polluting the water table FFS! This kind of stuff makes the tar sands look like an eco park by comparison!  They must have awfully good lobbiest in the US to keep this kind of thing going!

[Ice]

As I said, not EVERYONE can afford to keep a second vehicle (be it space or price).
The fear I am saying is that each household being restricted to ONE vehicle... and it may as well be a Corolla.
Could you live with that?

No, but almost everyone could.  And it's always been like that.  There's never been a "do it all" vehicle that appeals to enthusiasts.

Everyone could?
Cost of the vehicle, Insurance, space, not everyone has a double-attached garage and not everyone makes $100k household income.

There's never a "do it all" vehicle, but there are compromises vehicles.
Like the Subaru STi.  Perfect family sedan (for enthusiasts) ?
 
I think I am thankful that I had the RX-8 when I did, I may not see another chance to get another RWD manual sports car.

All of the people we know have a minimum of 2 cars per household and have at least a double garage.  While you Toronto types might be happy living in a 300sq ft apartment on the 44th floor.....the ROC lives in houses.

Sent from my Galaxy S3

We have two cars ( but both just 4 cyl hatchbacks) and a small single garage  attached to a house.   Everyone we know has two cars. Including a single person. One couple has 4 cars, one fancy coupe, one winter AWD and two sports cars.

We could live with just the Fit...but why should we.  Somebody has to help use all the resources before the greenies and the back to the stone age people take over.

Why does a single person have two cars? The only scenario I can see is that one is a commuter and one is for track day... (IMHO the Corolla makes the perfect commuter car).

Don't fear the "greenies"... fear actually running out of the stuff that makes the modern western world go round. Better hope we innovate our way out of the corner we have ourselves backed into right now.

That person keeps horses and donkeys so one "car" is an enormous pickup for getting hay and pulling a trailer thingy sometimes. The other is a small efficient hatchback.

We won't run out of any resources in the remainder  of my lifetime...but there are a gang of people who want us to stop using them...or if you prefer, want us to have a low energy lifestyle in the western world and travel on buses and not fly when we wish...you know who I mean...people who hold climate conferences in Bali.  The higher purpose people who are absolutely sure that they know best. The people who  flit off the the USA for instant medical care while the rest queue for example.

Those two cars do make perfect sense in that case.

No, I'm not sure who those people are. Not real environmentalists anyways. Sounds more like corporate types and politicians. Maybe they can fly away for their conference and stay there for all of the good they are doing.

One thing is for sure... either we're going to need to dream up some new ways to continue our lifestyle or eventually it will be taken away from us due to scarcity. Maybe not in your lifetime but legacy is important...

The thing that scares me the most is some of the bottom-feeder technologies being employed to eke out fuel from sensitive areas!  The latest is this fracking nonsense where huge amounts of pressurized water and toxic chemicals are injected into the ground to remove whatever fuel is trapped in the rock fissures in the soil substrate and polluting the water table as a result.  Polluting the water table FFS! This kind of stuff makes the tar sands look like an eco park by comparison!  They must have awfully good lobbiest in the US to keep this kind of thing going!

You bet they do... they own everything!

[conwelpic]

posted September 2nd

http://ca.autoblog.com/2013/09/02/2014-toyota-corolla-s-6mt/

[Black Hatch]

When we bought the Corolla, we drove all the various compacts, and I was anticipating something a little more exciting from the 3.  Frankly, with all the hype, I figured unicorns with rainbows shooting out their arses would be less exciting than driving the 3.

And what I found was just another FWD car that wants to burn the front tires to nothing at the slightest hint of actually being pushed.

Meh

Um? You expected a FWD compact to NOT burn the front tires when pushed? Its not AWD.

You should have taken the test-drive driving up groat road and compared the Corolla and Mazda3 and feel which comes close to the limit.
Pushed 80kph+ with the Mazda6 (100kph with the RX-8) without leaving the inside lane.
Try it with a Corolla and tell me how comfortable (with the chassis, steering feedback) when you are at that speed.

Alternatively try this on a round-about exit - Whitemud SB exit to Foxdrive, 91st SB to Anthony Henday, etc

Note: not that I condone driving fast up Groat Road

[Black Hatch]

As I said, not EVERYONE can afford to keep a second vehicle (be it space or price).
The fear I am saying is that each household being restricted to ONE vehicle... and it may as well be a Corolla.
Could you live with that?

No, but almost everyone could.  And it's always been like that.  There's never been a "do it all" vehicle that appeals to enthusiasts.

Everyone could?
Cost of the vehicle, Insurance, space, not everyone has a double-attached garage and not everyone makes $100k household income.

There's never a "do it all" vehicle, but there are compromises vehicles.
Like the Subaru STi.  Perfect family sedan (for enthusiasts) ?
 
I think I am thankful that I had the RX-8 when I did, I may not see another chance to get another RWD manual sports car.

All of the people we know have a minimum of 2 cars per household and have at least a double garage.  While you Toronto types might be happy living in a 300sq ft apartment on the 44th floor.....the ROC lives in houses.

Sent from my Galaxy S3

We have two cars ( but both just 4 cyl hatchbacks) and a small single garage  attached to a house.   Everyone we know has two cars. Including a single person. One couple has 4 cars, one fancy coupe, one winter AWD and two sports cars.

We could live with just the Fit...but why should we.  Somebody has to help use all the resources before the greenies and the back to the stone age people take over.

Why does a single person have two cars? The only scenario I can see is that one is a commuter and one is for track day... (IMHO the Corolla makes the perfect commuter car).

Don't fear the "greenies"... fear actually running out of the stuff that makes the modern western world go round. Better hope we innovate our way out of the corner we have ourselves backed into right now.

I guess my point was lost since no one can imagine the utopia where we only have one auto manufacturer Toyota and we can only have one car for our DD; sure two Toyotas for per household if you wish.
And the only Toyotas they are selling are the Corolla and Tundra. (What else do we need is essential? Needs not wants)
The new image of the Corolla will be a CVT hybrid and beige with an underpower reliable engine.
(Sorry in this world Scion FR-S, GT-86 don't exist)

[dkaz]

Pushed 80kph+ with the Mazda6 (100kph with the RX-8) without leaving the inside lane.
Try it with a Corolla and tell me how comfortable (with the chassis, steering feedback) when you are at that speed.

Alternatively try this on a round-about exit - Whitemud SB exit to Foxdrive, 91st SB to Anthony Henday, etc

Note: not that I condone driving fast up Groat Road

I was unsure about making the drive to Edmonton this time around but you're making it very tempting lol.

[Fobroader]

Pushed 80kph+ with the Mazda6 (100kph with the RX-8) without leaving the inside lane.
Try it with a Corolla and tell me how comfortable (with the chassis, steering feedback) when you are at that speed.

Alternatively try this on a round-about exit - Whitemud SB exit to Foxdrive, 91st SB to Anthony Henday, etc

Note: not that I condone driving fast up Groat Road

I was unsure about making the drive to Edmonton this time around but you're making it very tempting lol.

Groat road, late at night in the summer....well worth the drive!! 

[dkaz]

Groat road, late at night in the summer....well worth the drive!! 

Lol. Last time I went barreling down Groat Road was back in 08 in the Corolla with my friend with the STI. I couldn't tell who was more terrified. Lol.

posted September 2nd

http://ca.autoblog.com/2013/09/02/2014-toyota-corolla-s-6mt/

Thanks for the link.

I really like the interior. After 21 years and 4 generations, Toyota finally decided to retire the straight vertical stack. Add on another 5 years if you consider the 88-92 a predecessor.

Glad to hear they improved the manual transmission. My 08's really sucked. My 91 Corolla could handle quick shifts without whining and grinding.

I'm still not convinced about the suspension setup. We will see.

Kinda hard to get excited about a 132HP engine when you can get a Skyactiv 3 for the same money with more HP and slightly better fuel economy. The S should be the next trim the Valvematic engine goes to.

[johngenx]

Um? You expected a FWD compact to NOT burn the front tires when pushed? Its not AWD.

Drive a VW GTI.  Yeah, it still understeers, but nothing like the $20K compact cars.  It's probably the best FWD I've driven.  Of course, it's priced higher and NOT intended mass consumption.

You should have taken the test-drive driving up groat road and compared the Corolla and Mazda3 and feel which comes close to the limit.

I know lots of good roads easily accessible from the west end.  I don't do the standard "test drive loop" the dealers encourage.  I push them through some bends (one is an off camber corner with a dip in the middle, a real test) and on some rough spots, etc.  Comparing like models (so no big performance tires on one, etc) the 3 felt perhaps a tiny bit better in transitions, but otherwise not really any different than any of the other cars.

Try it with a Corolla and tell me how comfortable (with the chassis, steering feedback) when you are at that speed.

The idea that a Corolla turns into a wobbling mass of jelly the instant the speed limit nears is wrong.  It's not an entertaining car to drive, but it is safe and composed.  This summer I chased a new Camaro up the Miette Hot Springs road in Jasper, and I think the Chev driver was more than a little surprised.

[tpl]

The idea that a Corolla turns into a wobbling mass of jelly the instant the speed limit nears is wrong.  It's not an entertaining car to drive, but it is safe and composed.  This summer I chased a new Camaro up the Miette Hot Springs road in Jasper, and I think the Chev driver was more than a little surprised.

A good point.    Shows that the Corolla is a good car and well designed for its use.

[KD]

Um? You expected a FWD compact to NOT burn the front tires when pushed? Its not AWD.

The idea that a Corolla turns into a wobbling mass of jelly the instant the speed limit nears is wrong.  It's not an entertaining car to drive, but it is safe and composed.  This summer I chased a new Camaro up the Miette Hot Springs road in Jasper, and I think the Chev driver was more than a little surprised.

I bet she was!  Probably thought you were her mother! 

[bombastic]

As I said, not EVERYONE can afford to keep a second vehicle (be it space or price).
The fear I am saying is that each household being restricted to ONE vehicle... and it may as well be a Corolla.
Could you live with that?

No, but almost everyone could.  And it's always been like that.  There's never been a "do it all" vehicle that appeals to enthusiasts.

Everyone could?
Cost of the vehicle, Insurance, space, not everyone has a double-attached garage and not everyone makes $100k household income.

There's never a "do it all" vehicle, but there are compromises vehicles.
Like the Subaru STi.  Perfect family sedan (for enthusiasts) ?
 
I think I am thankful that I had the RX-8 when I did, I may not see another chance to get another RWD manual sports car.

All of the people we know have a minimum of 2 cars per household and have at least a double garage.  While you Toronto types might be happy living in a 300sq ft apartment on the 44th floor.....the ROC lives in houses.

Sent from my Galaxy S3

We have two cars ( but both just 4 cyl hatchbacks) and a small single garage  attached to a house.   Everyone we know has two cars. Including a single person. One couple has 4 cars, one fancy coupe, one winter AWD and two sports cars.

We could live with just the Fit...but why should we.  Somebody has to help use all the resources before the greenies and the back to the stone age people take over.

Why does a single person have two cars? The only scenario I can see is that one is a commuter and one is for track day... (IMHO the Corolla makes the perfect commuter car).

Don't fear the "greenies"... fear actually running out of the stuff that makes the modern western world go round. Better hope we innovate our way out of the corner we have ourselves backed into right now.

I guess my point was lost since no one can imagine the utopia where we only have one auto manufacturer Toyota and we can only have one car for our DD; sure two Toyotas for per household if you wish.
And the only Toyotas they are selling are the Corolla and Tundra. (What else do we need is essential? Needs not wants)
The new image of the Corolla will be a CVT hybrid and beige with an underpower reliable engine.
(Sorry in this world Scion FR-S, GT-86 don't exist)

What else do we need? Why do I need Tundra? Give me a minivan!!!!!

[Noto]

...
oh, and 100% on rear drums... they last forever and i don't think all that many people on today's roads really need to worry that much about heat dissipation.

I disagree - brakes are one thing I never want anyone to cheap out on.  Yes, drums are inferior for heat dissipation, but my bigger concern is the build-up of crud, water, etc. in the drum.  Discs use centrifugal forces to reduce particulate build-up between the pads and the discs.  There's a reason why brakes work better in dry environments and when brand new.

I begrudgingly accepted that the Corolla had rear drums, and it may stop shorter than some of its competitors with discs all around, but that still doesn't seem acceptable to me for their use to remain so widespread.  I'd support every car having ceramic Brembo's for better emergency response.  It all comes down to economics, and I'd like to see the actual cost difference for rear drums:discs to justify their continued use when better tech is available.

We all talk about car safety features when a crash occurs - I'd rather we focus on crash avoidance.
_______________________________________________________

As far as the Corolla goes, my only concern is that it's growth is starting to push into mid-size territory.  182in is long for a compact, considering my 2011 Forester XT is 179.5in and even the newer, longer 2014 I've been eyeing is 180.9in.

[quadzilla]

I begrudgingly accepted that the Corolla had rear drums, and it may stop shorter than some of its competitors with discs all around, but that still doesn't seem acceptable to me for their use to remain so widespread.  I'd support every car having ceramic Brembo's for better emergency response.  It all comes down to economics, and I'd like to see the actual cost difference for rear drums:discs to justify their continued use when better tech is available.

We all talk about car safety features when a crash occurs - I'd rather we focus on crash avoidance.

So you would rather have a car with 4 discs that takes longer to stop than one with rear drums that takes less distance to top?

[tooscoops]

i agree in some principal on the disks... but from over a decade of driving drums... i have never had an issue... disks, i have had many issues. though in theory, build op of crud will happen and should really mess em up.... i've never had it happen. rear brake service every once in a while and i'm good. rotors, i've had clips come off, warping, faulty pads, pitted/grooved rotors...

i think knowing how well my car stops and driving appropriately would be more beneficial than just having amazing brakes.

[Sir Osis of Liver]

i agree in some principal on the disks... but from over a decade of driving drums... i have never had an issue... disks, i have had many issues. though in theory, build op of crud will happen and should really mess em up.... i've never had it happen. rear brake service every once in a while and i'm good. rotors, i've had clips come off, warping, faulty pads, pitted/grooved rotors...

i think knowing how well my car stops and driving appropriately would be more beneficial than just having amazing brakes.

  Same as my experience in the Maritimes. Lots of road salt and grit. I had much better service life out of drums than discs.

My Ranger, Toyota pickup and Tercel all saw over 300k on their original rear drums. I think they each had replacement shoes and brake kits around the 150k mark. My F150 company truck was well up there and needed drums due to corrosion, but that thing had waded through salt water a number of times.

[KD]

i agree in some principal on the disks... but from over a decade of driving drums... i have never had an issue... disks, i have had many issues. though in theory, build op of crud will happen and should really mess em up.... i've never had it happen. rear brake service every once in a while and i'm good. rotors, i've had clips come off, warping, faulty pads, pitted/grooved rotors...

i think knowing how well my car stops and driving appropriately would be more beneficial than just having amazing brakes.

  Same as my experience in the Maritimes. Lots of road salt and grit. I had much better service life out of drums than discs.

My Ranger, Toyota pickup and Tercel all saw over 300k on their original rear drums. I think they each had replacement shoes and brake kits around the 150k mark. My F150 company truck was well up there and needed drums due to corrosion, but that thing had waded through salt water a number of times.

Yes, rear drums are the only way to go for longevity in this climate especially on a truck!

[Northernridge]

i agree in some principal on the disks... but from over a decade of driving drums... i have never had an issue... disks, i have had many issues. though in theory, build op of crud will happen and should really mess em up.... i've never had it happen. rear brake service every once in a while and i'm good. rotors, i've had clips come off, warping, faulty pads, pitted/grooved rotors...

i think knowing how well my car stops and driving appropriately would be more beneficial than just having amazing brakes.

  Same as my experience in the Maritimes. Lots of road salt and grit. I had much better service life out of drums than discs.

My Ranger, Toyota pickup and Tercel all saw over 300k on their original rear drums. I think they each had replacement shoes and brake kits around the 150k mark. My F150 company truck was well up there and needed drums due to corrosion, but that thing had waded through salt water a number of times.

Yes, rear drums are the only way to go for longevity in this climate especially on a truck!

My Sierra has rear drums and every time I hit the brakes...the truck stops. Honestly I can't tell the difference from previous trucks. Although my current needs are light duty compared to the last few trucks.

[johngenx]

Four wheel discs on an economy compact are for show.  They have huge front weight bias and need the front discs, but the rear brakes aren't really working all that hard.  Also, the chassis of the car cries "uncle" before the brakes do.  The compact class all fall over onto their understeering knees before they can make enough speed to fry the brakes.  (Well, save for the limited production cars like the GTI...)

My Miata, though very light, has a 50/50 weight distribution and engages the rear tires more during hard braking.  It also has a "drive me HARD" mission, and the better fade resistance of the discs helps keep the car composed on the 50th bend of that very tight mountain road that you're driving at 8/10 or more.

Also, I'm not sure Mazda could have marketed the Miata with rear drums.  For model year 1994 they actually installed the Spec Racer brakes (up 1" from 90-93) recognizing that people were getting pretty frisky with the cars, and lots of people were competing in some form of motorsports with them.

If anyone's had the chance to put a 911 to the test in braking, even the old cars bite HARD.  The rear bias means that even under very hard braking (front weight shift) the rear tires get lots of action.

[rrocket]

If anyone's had the chance to put a 911 to the test in braking, even the old cars bite HARD.  The rear bias means that even under very hard braking (front weight shift) the rear tires get lots of action.

Yea, I noticed.  I was surprised to check the "check brake pads" light illuminated.  When I went around and checked, it was a rear driver pad sensor that wore through...which meant the pads needed replacing.