Quote from: Inigo Montoya on April 30, 2013, 02:41:27 pmBuick as a brand is outselling Acura in the US by about 13000 units year to date. It's also outselling Audi, Infiniti, Lincoln and Volvo, with sales up by 27% YTD.This is greatly due to Cash back incentives.Also, isn't there three times as many Buick dealers in the US than Acura, expecially evident in the smaller centres? Might sway sales figures.
Buick as a brand is outselling Acura in the US by about 13000 units year to date. It's also outselling Audi, Infiniti, Lincoln and Volvo, with sales up by 27% YTD.
Quote from: jhonnybravo on April 30, 2013, 04:51:02 pmAcura really has nothing to offer in this class anymore that is competitive enough to run with MB, BMW, and now even Cadillac.This is your first post? Any car that can be within 0.5 of a second on a fairly tight track with an S4, that isn't too bad at all.Looks like Acura had no trouble beating MB and Cadillac here:http://www.motorweek.org/reviews/comparison_tests/46k_sport_sedan_shootout
Acura really has nothing to offer in this class anymore that is competitive enough to run with MB, BMW, and now even Cadillac.
Quote from: bombastic on April 30, 2013, 07:44:41 pmQuote from: Vmango on April 30, 2013, 10:41:15 amThe Acura TL SH-AWD Tech with the manual should have been a part of this test and should be a consideration.While it's certainly "middle of the road" in comparison with the competition it puts up some damn good numbers and offers better value for money - to Redman's point.The FR-S isn't a sedan and certainly can't work for family duty like the cars mentioned. If you sit in a 335 or S4 after sitting in a FR-S you will think it's twice the car.....because it is.Acura is not a true luxury brand. So as it was said before. Value for money is a quite relative term. People buying German cars don;t really care at the Japanese competitors. Lexus might be an exception. Have you ever driven one? or even sat in one?
Quote from: Vmango on April 30, 2013, 10:41:15 amThe Acura TL SH-AWD Tech with the manual should have been a part of this test and should be a consideration.While it's certainly "middle of the road" in comparison with the competition it puts up some damn good numbers and offers better value for money - to Redman's point.The FR-S isn't a sedan and certainly can't work for family duty like the cars mentioned. If you sit in a 335 or S4 after sitting in a FR-S you will think it's twice the car.....because it is.Acura is not a true luxury brand. So as it was said before. Value for money is a quite relative term. People buying German cars don;t really care at the Japanese competitors. Lexus might be an exception.
The Acura TL SH-AWD Tech with the manual should have been a part of this test and should be a consideration.While it's certainly "middle of the road" in comparison with the competition it puts up some damn good numbers and offers better value for money - to Redman's point.The FR-S isn't a sedan and certainly can't work for family duty like the cars mentioned. If you sit in a 335 or S4 after sitting in a FR-S you will think it's twice the car.....because it is.
Quote from: bombastic on April 30, 2013, 07:44:41 pmQuote from: Vmango on April 30, 2013, 10:41:15 amThe Acura TL SH-AWD Tech with the manual should have been a part of this test and should be a consideration.While it's certainly "middle of the road" in comparison with the competition it puts up some damn good numbers and offers better value for money - to Redman's point.The FR-S isn't a sedan and certainly can't work for family duty like the cars mentioned. If you sit in a 335 or S4 after sitting in a FR-S you will think it's twice the car.....because it is.Acura is not a true luxury brand. So as it was said before. Value for money is a quite relative term. People buying German cars don;t really care at the Japanese competitors. Lexus might be an exception.See, what does that mean "people who by German cars?" That's such a loaded statement. I literally went out to buy a German car and bought a TL. WTF are you talking about? Also, in terms of "near-luxury" I don't know what that means either. The interior of my TL BLOWS AWAY my the interior of my parent's A4...it's an entry level A4 but still they cost the same. No one is saying the TL is the best car here. Indeed, it's probably far from it. However, when you're walking into dealerships ready to spend 50K of your hard-earned money you look at things from a broader context. If my budget was 60 or 70K, yeah, I wouldn't buy a TL...but if we're talking broader context the TL is a worthy option, IMO.
Looking at you vehicles you are a Honda fanboy.
Can't argue with the results of this comparison. The S4 is a fantastic car...but it's pretty much priced between the 335i and the M3 (or C350 and C63, IS350 and IS-F). I was offered a great deal on a pre-facelift 2012 S4...still wonder if I made the right decision You can really see how subjective these comparisons can be. Sometimes the ATS and C350 rank high, here they are near the bottom. It also goes to show how tight this segment is.Did the authors set out to test AWD models only? The problem with the 335i xdrive is that with the "Sport Line" or even the "M-Sport" model, you don't get the sports suspension. The author did note that the 335i may not have got as many points for comfort had it been equipped with the sport suspension...but I can tell you that my 335i with the optional sport suspension is nowhere near as harsh as the E90 or my previous 135i with sport suspension (pleases my wife, displeases me).I'm surprised the 335i had 17"s on. Not only do they look silly in the big wheel wells, but I couldn't even fit my old 17" winters on and had to go up to 18"s for winter. It's also worth noting that the 335i Sport Line now comes standard with 18" allseasons standard! WTF?! I had to upgrade to the 19"s to get low pro summers. Do the other cars in this segment come standard with allseason too?
]Is that you Meow? Are you back under another name? Please troll elsewhere.
Looking at you vehicles you are a Honda fanboy. Most buyers disagree with you. Hence dismal sales that Acura has. It is near luxury. Luxury is 60-70% perception. And Acura does not have it. Period
Would hardly call that "poor" sales.
Quote from: Vmango on April 30, 2013, 08:31:22 pmNo one is saying the TL is the best car here. Indeed, it's probably far from it. Actually a few posts back it was declared the winner!
No one is saying the TL is the best car here. Indeed, it's probably far from it.
Quote from: bombastic on May 01, 2013, 04:53:32 pmLooking at you vehicles you are a Honda fanboy.Is that you Meow? Are you back under another name? Please troll elsewhere.
Quote from: bombastic on May 01, 2013, 04:53:32 pmLooking at you vehicles you are a Honda fanboy. Most buyers disagree with you. Hence dismal sales that Acura has. It is near luxury. Luxury is 60-70% perception. And Acura does not have it. PeriodDismal sales? Acura outsold Audi, Porsche, Cadillac, Infiniti, Lincoln, to name a few in April sales.Would hardly call that "poor" sales.
http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2013/05/usa-auto-brand-sales-figures-april-2013-rankings.html
My only point, as a TL owner, would be that I think the TL is REALLY underrated. Just the attitude of a number of the posters here clearly reveals that: a) they don't know what they're talking about and b) certainly haven't driven a SH-AWD TL.
Quote from: bombastic on May 01, 2013, 04:53:32 pmQuote from: Vmango on April 30, 2013, 08:31:22 pmQuote from: bombastic on April 30, 2013, 07:44:41 pmQuote from: Vmango on April 30, 2013, 10:41:15 amThe Acura TL SH-AWD Tech with the manual should have been a part of this test and should be a consideration.While it's certainly "middle of the road" in comparison with the competition it puts up some damn good numbers and offers better value for money - to Redman's point.The FR-S isn't a sedan and certainly can't work for family duty like the cars mentioned. If you sit in a 335 or S4 after sitting in a FR-S you will think it's twice the car.....because it is.Acura is not a true luxury brand. So as it was said before. Value for money is a quite relative term. People buying German cars don;t really care at the Japanese competitors. Lexus might be an exception.See, what does that mean "people who by German cars?" That's such a loaded statement. I literally went out to buy a German car and bought a TL. WTF are you talking about? Also, in terms of "near-luxury" I don't know what that means either. The interior of my TL BLOWS AWAY my the interior of my parent's A4...it's an entry level A4 but still they cost the same. No one is saying the TL is the best car here. Indeed, it's probably far from it. However, when you're walking into dealerships ready to spend 50K of your hard-earned money you look at things from a broader context. If my budget was 60 or 70K, yeah, I wouldn't buy a TL...but if we're talking broader context the TL is a worthy option, IMO.Looking at you vehicles you are a Honda fanboy. Most buyers disagree with you. Hence dismal sales that Acura has. It is near luxury. Luxury is 60-70% perception. And Acura does not have it. PeriodWow. A Honda fanboy. I never would believe I'd be called that. Listen, spend some time on the forum before you go calling people fanboys. I think if you looked at what I've driven and what car I constantly lust over you'd realize I'm no Honda fanboy. The TL is my first Honda I've owned, other than my lawnmower. MY wife drives an MDX, that I enjoy driving up to my family cottage. I also never pushed "my car." I merely stated (to the author) that it would add an interesting dynamic if you considered price and the value perspective. I believe I've mentioned several times here, in an attempt to appear unbiased, that the TL would probably finish last in this comparo. If someone put all these cars in front of me as said "take one for free" I wouldn't take the TL...it's not really in the same class in the sense it's a bit in no man's land.My only point, as a TL owner, would be that I think the TL is REALLY underrated. Just the attitude of a number of the posters here clearly reveals that: a) they don't know what they're talking about and b) certainly haven't driven a SH-AWD TL. Let's be clear again. No one is saying the TL would come in here and compete on an equal footing. Essentially, a few of us have stated that it exists as an interesting value proposition and doesn't give up "too much" in comparison considering you're looking at something 15K-20K less. This is a fact that cannot be denied. That's it. Let's please move on.
Quote from: Vmango on April 30, 2013, 08:31:22 pmQuote from: bombastic on April 30, 2013, 07:44:41 pmQuote from: Vmango on April 30, 2013, 10:41:15 amThe Acura TL SH-AWD Tech with the manual should have been a part of this test and should be a consideration.While it's certainly "middle of the road" in comparison with the competition it puts up some damn good numbers and offers better value for money - to Redman's point.The FR-S isn't a sedan and certainly can't work for family duty like the cars mentioned. If you sit in a 335 or S4 after sitting in a FR-S you will think it's twice the car.....because it is.Acura is not a true luxury brand. So as it was said before. Value for money is a quite relative term. People buying German cars don;t really care at the Japanese competitors. Lexus might be an exception.See, what does that mean "people who by German cars?" That's such a loaded statement. I literally went out to buy a German car and bought a TL. WTF are you talking about? Also, in terms of "near-luxury" I don't know what that means either. The interior of my TL BLOWS AWAY my the interior of my parent's A4...it's an entry level A4 but still they cost the same. No one is saying the TL is the best car here. Indeed, it's probably far from it. However, when you're walking into dealerships ready to spend 50K of your hard-earned money you look at things from a broader context. If my budget was 60 or 70K, yeah, I wouldn't buy a TL...but if we're talking broader context the TL is a worthy option, IMO.Looking at you vehicles you are a Honda fanboy. Most buyers disagree with you. Hence dismal sales that Acura has. It is near luxury. Luxury is 60-70% perception. And Acura does not have it. Period
You can get the M adaptive suspension as an option, though. Really should be standard as part of the m-sport, but it does then allow you to firm up the dampers (Sport + or whatever the setting is is firmer than the passive setup in xdrive models).
