Topic: $235,000 speeding ticket

[EV Dan]

Give him a speeding ticket...give him jail time.  But seizing their car and selling it off so the gov't can pocket the money?  Sounds like organized crime....

It's a shame ... it happened in Canada. If we stop respecting peoples' rights to private property than sooner or later the government will be deciding for us what cars we should be driving, what homes we will own and how much we are allowed to have in the bank account before the money is seized and divided among the poor.
Charge them with attempted murder even, and let the lawyers sort it out, but have some respect for ppl who pay you taxes.

Yeah, cry me a river too.  
If these guys maybe respected other peoples lives, then it wouldn't be a concern.  But does respecting private property take precedence over respecting lives?
What would the end cost have been if one of these cars had hit a pedestrian?  Oh, I guess that's not as important as protecting their private property.
These guys knew the law and they choose to ignore it.  Besides, the gov't only gets 20% of the sale of the Ferrari.
Police state?  Bull Crap!  That's just a feeble excuse at trying to  justify breaking the law.

As for seizing the Harleys from the HA boys, that is sweet.  Hit them where it really hurts, their bikes.

I strongly disagree on the Harleys as well. Neither police nor the state should administer justice as they see fit. There are laws that regulate the way a society functions, and there should be a legal process of bringing offenders to justice. If the police decides what cars to sell and for how many km/h over the limit should entail such "verdict" then it won't be long before we have a police state or a dictatorship on our hands.
What is also worth mentioning is that we draw these conclusion based of what those officers told the media. We don't get to hear the alleged "offenders"
Why protection of private property is vital IMO is because without it nobody will give a , nobody will start a business, nobody will take a financial risk, there will be no such thing as entrepreneurship. Dividing common wealth based on individual needs , it will lead to general indifference and apathy, socialism and finally a third world country.
I'd rather them keep their Ferraris than all of us live in police run state of chaos.

[Dante]

Long time (1-2 years) license suspension should be the main punishment for such cases; the easiest and cheapest way to take these people off the road. 15 days is not nearly enough. High fines are OK as well (20K+). Second offence should be jail time no questions asked.
In 15 days the guy can race again in his new ride.
Confiscating and selling the car doesn't do anything for public safety or personal punishment; the car can easily be replaced.

[Sir Osis of Liver]

Confiscating and selling the car doesn't do anything for public safety or personal punishment; the car can easily be replaced.

If I took your car, and you still owed money on it, how quickly could you replace it?

[Sir Osis of Liver]

I strongly disagree on the Harleys as well. Neither police nor the state should administer justice as they see fit. There are laws that regulate the way a society functions, and there should be a legal process of bringing offenders to justice. If the police decides what cars to sell and for how many km/h over the limit should entail such "verdict" then it won't be long before we have a police state or a dictatorship on our hands.
What is also worth mentioning is that we draw these conclusion based of what those officers told the media. We don't get to hear the alleged "offenders"
Why protection of private property is vital IMO is because without it nobody will give a , nobody will start a business, nobody will take a financial risk, there will be no such thing as entrepreneurship. Dividing common wealth based on individual needs , it will lead to general indifference and apathy, socialism and finally a third world country.
I'd rather them keep their Ferraris than all of us live in police run state of chaos.

The police don't decide on the punishment, the courts do.

We haven't had property rights thus far and seem to be doing ok.

[Dante]

Confiscating and selling the car doesn't do anything for public safety or personal punishment; the car can easily be replaced.

If I took your car, and you still owed money on it, how quickly could you replace it?

He can own money on the car, but still have a fat bank account, investments, properties, etc.

[EV Dan]

I strongly disagree on the Harleys as well. Neither police nor the state should administer justice as they see fit. There are laws that regulate the way a society functions, and there should be a legal process of bringing offenders to justice. If the police decides what cars to sell and for how many km/h over the limit should entail such "verdict" then it won't be long before we have a police state or a dictatorship on our hands.
What is also worth mentioning is that we draw these conclusion based of what those officers told the media. We don't get to hear the alleged "offenders"
Why protection of private property is vital IMO is because without it nobody will give a , nobody will start a business, nobody will take a financial risk, there will be no such thing as entrepreneurship. Dividing common wealth based on individual needs , it will lead to general indifference and apathy, socialism and finally a third world country.
I'd rather them keep their Ferraris than all of us live in police run state of chaos.

The police don't decide on the punishment, the courts do.

We haven't had property rights thus far and seem to be doing ok.

From the article I got an impression the cars were impounded and sold at least before an appeal and to obvious financial loss of the co-owner of that Ferrari. How was he guilty of anything???

 "We haven't had property rights thus far and seem to be doing ok."

Where in Regina do you park you car, a public square?  

[Sir Osis of Liver]

Confiscating and selling the car doesn't do anything for public safety or personal punishment; the car can easily be replaced.

If I took your car, and you still owed money on it, how quickly could you replace it?

He can own money on the car, but still have a fat bank account, investments, properties, etc.

That's true. That's why I'd prefer a fine based on percentage of gross income. This is still a bigger disincentive than a $1k fine though.

[Dante]

Confiscating and selling the car doesn't do anything for public safety or personal punishment; the car can easily be replaced.

If I took your car, and you still owed money on it, how quickly could you replace it?

He can own money on the car, but still have a fat bank account, investments, properties, etc.

That's true. That's why I'd prefer a fine based on percentage of gross income. This is still a bigger disincentive than a $1k fine though.

Everyone should be equal in front of the law. Having different fines for different people, while it might seem good idea, I don't think it's fair.

[Sir Osis of Liver]

From the article I got an impression the cars were impounded and sold at least before an appeal and to obvious financial loss of the co-owner of that Ferrari. How was he guilty of anything???

 "We haven't had property rights thus far and seem to be doing ok."

Where in Regina do you park you car, a public square?  

The car can be impounded before conviction for a specified amount of time, but can't be auctioned until after conviction. I'm not sure what the BC law states, but I'd be surprised if they could auction it before either an appeal was denied or completed.

Oh, I have property, but I don't have an inalienable right to it.  

[Sir Osis of Liver]

Everyone should be equal in front of the law. Having different fines for different people, while it might seem good idea, I don't think it's fair.

Really? I don't think it fair that someone making $35k gets the same fine for speeding as someone making $1M. It's essentially a free pass for the rich, but a burden for the poor.

[dr_spock]

The car can be impounded before conviction for a specified amount of time, but can't be auctioned until after conviction. I'm not sure what the BC law states, but I'd be surprised if they could auction it before either an appeal was denied or completed.

Oh, I have property, but I don't have an inalienable right to it.  

Yup, not guaranteed in our Charter.  Property rights are protected under common law and statue law.  Those rights can be changed by government legislation.  


If I buy a gun and recklessly shoot one of you, will you guys still let me keep the gun afterwards?  

[Erik]

The police don't decide on the punishment, the courts do.

Not in Ontario. The stunt driving law allows the police to punish before a person goes to court.

[dkaz]

This is a well known law BC that they can take your car away from you if you are caught really excessively speeding. No surprises. If they pulled this out of their asses maybe it would be an issue but he sped like he did knowing the consequences. No pity from me.

[rrocket]

If I buy a gun and recklessly shoot one of you, will you guys still let me keep the gun afterwards?  

Do tell what $225,000 gun you're thinking of shooting me with....

[Sir Osis of Liver]

The police don't decide on the punishment, the courts do.

Not in Ontario. The stunt driving law allows the police to punish before a person goes to court.

Do you mean impounding before conviction? That is the most troubling part of the law.

[Sir Osis of Liver]

If I buy a gun and recklessly shoot one of you, will you guys still let me keep the gun afterwards?  

Do tell what $225,000 gun you're thinking of shooting me with....

Since you asked http://www.hoferwaffen.com/hofer_5.php?lang=en

[rrocket]

The police don't decide on the punishment, the courts do.

Not in Ontario. The stunt driving law allows the police to punish before a person goes to court.

Do you mean impounding before conviction? That is the most troubling part of the law.

Oh there's MUCH more troubling parts than that.  They can charge you with street racing without even seeing you do it..if they SUSPECT you were doing it.  That's even more troubling.  They determine, on the spot, whether you are guilty of not.

[rrocket]

If I buy a gun and recklessly shoot one of you, will you guys still let me keep the gun afterwards?  

Do tell what $225,000 gun you're thinking of shooting me with....

Since you asked http://www.hoferwaffen.com/hofer_5.php?lang=en

I mean, yea...you could go buy some old Holland & Holland or something. 

[Sir Osis of Liver]

The police don't decide on the punishment, the courts do.

Not in Ontario. The stunt driving law allows the police to punish before a person goes to court.

Do you mean impounding before conviction? That is the most troubling part of the law.

Oh there's MUCH more troubling parts than that.  They can charge you with street racing without even seeing you do it..if they SUSPECT you were doing it.  That's even more troubling.  They determine, on the spot, whether you are guilty of not.

The Ontario traffic laws are weird, especially the tribunals. You guys should sort that out.

[ArticSteve]

So is the confiscation about justice or profit?

Neither.  It's the spectacle of the seizure that speaks to the majority who take comfort in authoritarianism, ... as illustrated by some of the responses herein.  

It was a speeding infraction.   The type or value of the vehicle is irrelevant.  Consequently, the "state's" beef is with the operator.  How best to sanction the operator?

Auction the vehicle?  Return 50% of the proceeds to the co-owner, 30% to the operator because of a bank loan and 20% to the "state".  That's just plain nutty.  If it was a 1992 Honda Si registered to somebody's MOM would the proceeds of an auction, all of $500, be return to the MOM at the government's expense.  

Nope, this "law" and the subsequent media stories it's designed to generate sole purpose is to reassure the majority that the "authority" is in fact in control and keeping us safe from impending death which is ever lurking on a road near you.