Topic: Why Do People Hate On a Specific Manufacturer??

[Erik]

Hold On. What does GM have to do with this, HCRV? Quality is Job 1 was Ford:



Or has it been so long you forgot what car you drove?

Seems you have forgiven Porshce for this:



And this:

[safristi]

.... ....

[No H2O]

Hold On. What does GM have to do with this, HCRV?

They (and Chrysler) are the ones in trouble. Why is that? I mean, why would a company producing great cars be....in trouble?

Ford back when I bought mine was vastly better in fit/finish than the GMs and Chryslers I looked at. The Monza LOL...what a POS that was, I can't believe they even called it a car.

Put a Ford GT in my driveway and I'll be happy. 

[johngenx]

...why would a company producing great cars be....in trouble?

'Cause even companies making awesome cars screw up.  Porsche nearly went bankrupt in ~1990 when the market for high-end cars literally collapsed.  Their model line-up in 1990 was full of awesomeness, but no one could afford them.

[Sir Osis of Liver]

...why would a company producing great cars be....in trouble?

'Cause even companies making awesome cars screw up.  Porsche nearly went bankrupt in ~1990 when the market for high-end cars literally collapsed.  Their model line-up in 1990 was full of awesomeness, but no one could afford them.

Exactly. Everyone buggers up from time to time.

My sister had a 1984 VW Rabbit diesel. It made Dad's 1982 Escort look like an absolute paragon of reliability. By 1990 it was almost completely oxide and couldn't pass an NB safety inspection, so it was scrapped.

VW almost pulled out of NA in 1993, because they only sold a total of 50k cars. Fiat group left, so did Citroen (earlier), Alfa, Peugeot and Renault. The only thing that saved them were government interventions. I won't even mention the cars produced by the UK.

If it hadn't been for the cash infusion from the Daimler-Chrysler merger, lord knows what would have happened to Mercedes after all the crap they sold in the mid to late 1990s.

barrie got endless abuse because he couldn't get over a rust heap of a Honda Civic he had... in 1976.

[rrocket]

If it hadn't been for the cash infusion from the Daimler-Chrysler merger, lord knows what would have happened to Mercedes after all the crap they sold in the mid to late 1990s.

barrie got endless abuse because he couldn't get over a rust heap of a Honda Civic he had... in 1976.

Cash infusion?  Merger?  Daimler bought Chrysler.  There was no cash infusion in Daimler favor and no merger of equals.

[saint_satan]

For the past 16 years, there has been a Honda in my driveway.  For 15 of the last 20, there has been a Jeep.  I have an affinity for both.  As a family, we still love Honda.  Jeep is a mere shadow of itself and I'm looking elsewhere to replace my SUV.  If I "hate" anything, it's how one of the most valuable brands in the industry has been left to rot on the vine.  When Chryco was going bankrupt, I heard Nissan and Ford expressed interest in acquiring Jeep.  I wish either of them had followed through and spared us from the last 5-7 years of crap put out with a Jeep label...

[Sir Osis of Liver]

If it hadn't been for the cash infusion from the Daimler-Chrysler merger, lord knows what would have happened to Mercedes after all the crap they sold in the mid to late 1990s.

barrie got endless abuse because he couldn't get over a rust heap of a Honda Civic he had... in 1976.

Cash infusion?  Merger?  Daimler bought Chrysler.  There was no cash infusion in Daimler favor and no merger of equals.

Chrysler had $12B of cash on hand. When the merger happened more than $10B of it went directly into Mercedes product development.

[rrocket]

If it hadn't been for the cash infusion from the Daimler-Chrysler merger, lord knows what would have happened to Mercedes after all the crap they sold in the mid to late 1990s.

barrie got endless abuse because he couldn't get over a rust heap of a Honda Civic he had... in 1976.

Cash infusion?  Merger?  Daimler bought Chrysler.  There was no cash infusion in Daimler favor and no merger of equals.

Chrysler had $12B of cash on hand. When the merger happened more than $10B of it went directly into Mercedes product development.

Chrysler would not have survived without the "merger". MB would have.  IIRC MB bought Chrysler for $35 billion or so.

Did you read the book Taken For a Ride--How Daimler-Benz Drove off with Chrylser.

[Brig]

I've owned German (designed, not necessarily built) since 1999.  I live with the foibles and am happy to do so.  However, once Miss Jetta dies, I will have no problem evaluating other brands.  The newer, non-lesbian   iteration of the Impreza has definitely caught my eye, as has the Fiesta.  I do know that my next car will be a hatch, thanks to my frequent hiking and camping activities.

[rrocket]

But the Jetta has a decently sized trunk.  Is it too small for your gear??  Or would the hatch just make the loading easier?

[Sir Osis of Liver]

Chrysler would not have survived without the "merger". MB would have.  IIRC MB bought Chrysler for $35 billion or so.

Did you read the book Taken For a Ride--How Daimler-Benz Drove off with Chrylser.

Chrysler's survival certainly wasn't guaranteed. But $12B in cash could have paid for two brand new platforms.

Haven't read it.

[Brig]

But the Jetta has a decently sized trunk.  Is it too small for your gear??  Or would the hatch just make the loading easier?

Believe it or not (and I say this from experience), a hatch makes loading things much easier.  Yes, my current Jetta has fold-down seats, but it's not the same.  I want that vertical option.  My hiking buds have a) PT Cruiser or B) Pathfinder or c) Jeep or d) Yaris, and they have no issues.  

[rrocket]

But the Jetta has a decently sized trunk.  Is it too small for your gear??  Or would the hatch just make the loading easier?

Believe it or not (and I say this from experience), a hatch makes loading things much easier.  Yes, my current Jetta has fold-down seats, but it's not the same.  I want that vertical option.  My hiking buds have a) PT Cruiser or B) Pathfinder or c) Jeep or d) Yaris, and they have no issues.  

Ok...I can see that depending on how much gear you have...

[TopGun]

I only know of one specific brand-hater - that's our resident Hyundai-hating troll who uses his sig line to diss the brand and never lets an opportunity pass to say something negative about one of their models - whether the thread is about a Hyundai product, or not.

He tries to pass this off as "Well, just 'cause I don't LOVE the brand doesn't make me a hater!"  Except he doesn't love the brand in kind of the same way most kids don't love broccoli.
....

I took you off ignore long enough to read your "material".  I'm touched you've taken the time to delve inside my thought process to know what I love and don't love...unless of course you weren't referring to me...wasn't sure as you didn't come out and say it.

So if I'm the troll (hmm I'm really for Halloween then), what do we call you?  I decided to pay some homage back you to and took 5 minutes away from plotting Hyundai's demise to look at some of your posts.    And this is from one freak'n thread within 3 days sportsfans.  I can't explain his behaviour because I don't really care.

I get the feeling that if this car were powered by three underfed hamsters running on a treadmill there would be those who harumph about the power being perfectly "adequate".....

Agreed.  Not a crappy car - just not a sports sedan.....
 

.....The combination of anemic motor, more-pork-please weight and your prissy 3rd grade shool teacher for a transmission take this car WELL outside the sports sedan arena.
 

......I say "assuming" because I haven't driven the TSX.  I have driven the Buick and have a hard time believing that the TSX is that dull and lifeless in terms of the driving experience, but it could be.

.....
The Regal didn't provide much more in the way of driving enjoyment than my Dad's 4-pot Accord does.  Better chassis, similar power, more weight and a less responsive slushbox do not net out to anything resembling a sporting drive.  They are both perfectly good cars that will be perfectly satisfactory to the average commuter.  But sports sedans they most certainly are not.

[mmret]

Crazy ramblings

This is relevant to the thread how exactly?

To be fair to steve, his post answers the question, in part.

A lot of the hate is a result of the intersection of politics and economics, globalization, and the ebb and flow of geopolitical power.

[Erik]

Chrysler would not have survived without the "merger". MB would have.  IIRC MB bought Chrysler for $35 billion or so.

Did you read the book Taken For a Ride--How Daimler-Benz Drove off with Chrylser.

Chrysler's survival certainly wasn't guaranteed. But $12B in cash could have paid for two brand new platforms.

Haven't read it.

Chrysler was also immensely profitable at the time of the "merger of equals". Most profitable car company in the world on a per vehicle basis. Chrysler owned 23% of the US market before DB bought them and raped them.

It is very interesting to compare the interior quality of a Chrysler from the mid 90's to the ones from the early 00's. The quality of materials dropped dramatically. My dad bought a 1996 Intrepid, which is still running great in my brothers hands with over 350,000 km on it (including weekly runs to New Liskeard). When he replaced it with a 2004 Concorde, it was quite amazing to see how much the quality of the interior pieces had dropped. Mercedes certainly sucked all the money out of Chrysler!

[rrocket]

Mercedes platforms underpin most of the current Chryslers, including your 300C, no?

[Erik]

Mercedes platforms underpin most of the current Chryslers, including your 300C, no?

No.
My 300C uses Mercedes based suspension, a Mercedes transmission, steering column, seat frames, etc. The design was pushed through by Tom Gale (father of the Intrepid), as one last push for the old guys. DC had already started nickle and diming the company to death.

Only other Chrysler that I know of that was Mercedes based was the Crossfire, which was a Chrysler designed body and interior running SLK running gear. There was some talk about a Mercedes being based on the Viper, but I hear that fell through.

Now, I am certainly no expert of all things Mopar, so I am sure someone will correct me if I am wrong.

[Jaeger]

I took you off ignore long enough to read your "material".

As if you ever stopped.    It's a toss-up as to which of you obsesses over my posts more, SirO (who compulsively quotes and responds to them) Greg / Catseye (who compulsivley counts them) or you (who despite having me on "ignore" seems to have a bazillion of my quotes just lying close at hand). 

Your hater credentials are golden.  Now, don't you need to go find yourself a little Hyundai puppy to kick?

Jaeger