Topic: Acura CSX - Just how Canadian is it?

[Erik]

I'm curious to know the design history of the Acura CSX. I have heard and read online that it is designed in and for Canada, and that the JDM Civic is based on it. Just curious to know how much engineering goes into the design locally.

Pretty cool to see the only car made in, designed in and manufactured in Canada.

[CatsEye68]

I'm curious to know the design history of the Acura CSX. I have heard and read online that it is designed in and for Canada, and that the JDM Civic is based on it. Just curious to know how much engineering goes into the design locally.

Pretty cool to see the only car made in, designed in and manufactured in Canada.

Is this the Acura version of the Civic?

I always thought those were simply a Civic with nicer interiors and wheels. Seriously. Designed in Canada? Maybe the upholstery patterns. Doubt if the actual mechanical bits have any design basis here.

[Erik]

I'm curious to know the design history of the Acura CSX. I have heard and read online that it is designed in and for Canada, and that the JDM Civic is based on it. Just curious to know how much engineering goes into the design locally.

Pretty cool to see the only car made in, designed in and manufactured in Canada.

Is this the Acura version of the Civic?

I always thought those were simply a Civic with nicer interiors and wheels. Seriously. Designed in Canada? Maybe the upholstery patterns. Doubt if the actual mechanical bits have any design basis here.

From what I have heard, it is more than just upholstery. I have heard that they did the exterior design, suspension, etc. Major mechanicals were obviously pulled from the Honda corporate parts bin. But even tailoring it just to Canada is kinda cool.

[rrocket]

I'm curious to know the design history of the Acura CSX. I have heard and read online that it is designed in and for Canada, and that the JDM Civic is based on it. Just curious to know how much engineering goes into the design locally.

Pretty cool to see the only car made in, designed in and manufactured in Canada.

Is this the Acura version of the Civic?

I always thought those were simply a Civic with nicer interiors and wheels. Seriously. Designed in Canada? Maybe the upholstery patterns. Doubt if the actual mechanical bits have any design basis here.

Yes, it was designed in Canada.  Honda thought so much of the design, that the Acura CSX forms the basis for the Japan-Only (JDM) Honda Civic.  So it's the other way around...the Civic is a decontented CSX.

"“The CSX is not a rebadged JDM Honda Civic, rather Honda Japan chose the Canadian-designed CSX as the JDM Civic - the JDM Civic is in fact a rebadged Acura."

"...contrary to a popular misconception, Acura Canada didn't merely re-badge a Japanese Civic with an Acura label, but rather designed the car from scratch, more or less, at which point it was adopted by Honda Japan, as its new Civic; Japanese buyers traditionally being more conservative than North Americans and/or Europeans when it comes to design."

[mmret]

So the two tier dash is a creation of Acura Canada?

Or is the NA Civic the foundation for the CSX (which is a Civic with some different mechanicals but the same interior, basically) and then in turn is the foundation for the JDM Civic?

This is all very circular.

[Erik]

So the two tier dash is a creation of Acura Canada?

Or is the NA Civic the foundation for the CSX (which is a Civic with some different mechanicals but the same interior, basically) and then in turn is the foundation for the JDM Civic?

This is all very circular.

I agree.
 What rrocket  posts is what I have heard too, but I don't really understand. I can't imagine Honda Canada having the engineering resources to design the entire car. Engine, transmission, chassis, etc had to be designed by Honda in Japan, I would imagine. I could see the exterior design, maybe coming from Canada. Plus parts bin raiding to get the best bits for the car.

[McGarnagle]

So the two tier dash is a creation of Acura Canada?

Or is the NA Civic the foundation for the CSX (which is a Civic with some different mechanicals but the same interior, basically) and then in turn is the foundation for the JDM Civic?

This is all very circular.

The interior (digital speedometer, etc.) was designed for the Japanese Civic and carried over to other markets.

[The Mighty Duck]

Yes, it was designed in Canada.  Honda thought so much of the design, that the Acura CSX forms the basis for the Japan-Only (JDM) Honda Civic.  So it's the other way around...the Civic is a decontented CSX.

"“The CSX is not a rebadged JDM Honda Civic, rather Honda Japan chose the Canadian-designed CSX as the JDM Civic - the JDM Civic is in fact a rebadged Acura."

"...contrary to a popular misconception, Acura Canada didn't merely re-badge a Japanese Civic with an Acura label, but rather designed the car from scratch, more or less, at which point it was adopted by Honda Japan, as its new Civic; Japanese buyers traditionally being more conservative than North Americans and/or Europeans when it comes to design."

That doesn't make sense. The USDM Civic forms the basis of the Acura CSX, which would mean the JDM and USDM Civic are essentially the same car... hardly "Japan only".

[footlong58]

I had a 1997 Acura 1.6EL, also built in Canada, and I can say with 100% confidence that was the best built car I've ever had.  It was 10 years old, had around 200,000 km on it, and I drove it from Winnipeg to Los Angeles, and back up the west coast, and the car performed without a hiccup.  Dead heat of summer, with the ac on, in the mountains...

The engine ran like a top, the car had zero rattles or creaks from the interior, suspension and steering was tight, I can't say enough good things about that car.

I'd buy a CSX in a second if it is anything like my old EL.

[MKII]

It would be an interesting read if CanadianDriver could interview the Acura Canadian Design Team who penned the CSX.
Hey Wing maybe you can make this happen?

As far as I can find thru research on Acura Canada's design studios I could not find any such department, as Honda is not an easy company to find/share any details on their car design, platforms etc information.
Seems the closest design team and studio is in California, but maybe they have a couple Canadians on the USA team that would be willing to discuss their Canadian designed vehicle.

If you can find someone to speak about the Canadian designed CSX, also could you bring up Acura Canada's current sales expectations for the CSX.
I know when they first spoke about the CSX back in 2006 expected sales numbers were 5,500. Seeing that Acura Canada will be hard pressed to sell 2,000 CSX units in 2010, can Acura Canada make a business case to keep producing the car at such low volume.

Sales numbers for the Canadian CSX
2006  5,186
2007  3,729
2008  2,998
2009  2,536
2010 Year to date April 10 (4 months) 563

My understanding as far as costs to a manufacturer to assemble a unique car, even if based on shared platform is in the neighbourhood of $50M.
I see companies doing this type of car in large markets where unit sales need to be in the 25,000 to 40,000 units per year to make a business case for such vehicles.

Unless Acura Canada is exporting the CSX to Japan as the 4 door Civic and supplying some of the markets in Europe that sell the 4 door Civic sedan.

My sense is that the Canadian designed CSX is the Japanese "engineered" Civic and Canadian design refers to the differences in longer hood, front & rear clip treatments.

But it would be most enlightening to hear from the Canadian designers to actually find out the details.

[CatsEye68]

I know when they first spoke about the CSX back in 2006 expected sales numbers were 5,500. Seeing that Acura Canada will be hard pressed to sell 2,000 CSX units in 2010, can Acura Canada make a business case to keep producing the car at such low volume.

Sales numbers for the Canadian CSX
2006  5,186
2007  3,729
2008  2,998
2009  2,536
2010 Year to date April 10 (4 months) 563

No surprise when you consider the market for what is essentially a tarted-up Civic priced at $30-$35K is going to be very small, even for the Honda faithful.

But it would be most enlightening to hear from the Canadian designers to actually find out the details.

I think you will be waiting quite a long time for that. Honda Canada is a sales and assembly company, not a design operation.

[initial_D]

Built in Canada, can't get any more Canadian than that?

I can see cosmetics, and bolt-on/off components being different, not much more than that.

[Thinking Out Loud]

Toyota needs a Corolla-based Lexus product to compete...call it the UA200 (Unintended Acceleration, plus borrow BMW's new don't-reflect-displacement by using '200' instead of '180' for the 1.8 litre).

The option package would be the UA200 Sport, which comes with shinier wheels, a trunklid spoiler and unique decals on the rear quarter panels.  Tip o' the hat to Honda's innovative marketing team for the Civic for that one.

Finally, spray some sound insulating foam throughout and new front and rear clips to look like an IS.

Voila!   

[CatsEye68]

Toyota needs a Corolla-based Lexus product to compete...call it the UA200 (Unintended Acceleration, plus borrow BMW's new don't-reflect-displacement by using '200' instead of '180' for the 1.8 litre).

The option package would be the UA200 Sport, which comes with shinier wheels, a trunklid spoiler and unique decals on the rear quarter panels.  Tip o' the hat to Honda's innovative marketing team for the Civic for that one.

Finally, spray some sound insulating foam throughout and new front and rear clips to look like an IS.

Voila!   

LOL... perhaps they could add a drag parachute option...

[diceman]

Slap an Acura badge on a Honda and you have your design history.

[Seafoam]

 Wasn't the whole idea behind this car to get Canadian's into Acura showrooms? Atleast it was for the first Acura El . At the time it was priced cheaper than the Integra and we have less disposable income tham American's. I guess it's Canadian in that respect. Is the CSX still only sold in Canada?

[JSCC]

It would be an interesting read if CanadianDriver could interview the Acura Canadian Design Team who penned the CSX.
Hey Wing maybe you can make this happen?

As far as I can find thru research on Acura Canada's design studios I could not find any such department, as Honda is not an easy company to find/share any details on their car design, platforms etc information.
Seems the closest design team and studio is in California, but maybe they have a couple Canadians on the USA team that would be willing to discuss their Canadian designed vehicle.

If you can find someone to speak about the Canadian designed CSX, also could you bring up Acura Canada's current sales expectations for the CSX.
I know when they first spoke about the CSX back in 2006 expected sales numbers were 5,500. Seeing that Acura Canada will be hard pressed to sell 2,000 CSX units in 2010, can Acura Canada make a business case to keep producing the car at such low volume.

Sales numbers for the Canadian CSX
2006  5,186
2007  3,729
2008  2,998
2009  2,536
2010 Year to date April 10 (4 months) 563

My understanding as far as costs to a manufacturer to assemble a unique car, even if based on shared platform is in the neighbourhood of $50M.
I see companies doing this type of car in large markets where unit sales need to be in the 25,000 to 40,000 units per year to make a business case for such vehicles.

Unless Acura Canada is exporting the CSX to Japan as the 4 door Civic and supplying some of the markets in Europe that sell the 4 door Civic sedan.

My sense is that the Canadian designed CSX is the Japanese "engineered" Civic and Canadian design refers to the differences in longer hood, front & rear clip treatments.

But it would be most enlightening to hear from the Canadian designers to actually find out the details.

There has been a lot of rumor/talk of the USA getting an entry level Acura, slotted below the TSX.
Chances are it will be the next generation 2012 CSX.

Total production could be pumped to 30,000+/year, which would justify the CSX model existence.

[McGarnagle]

Is the CSX still only sold in Canada?

Yes.

[MKII]

Wasn't the whole idea behind this car to get Canadian's into Acura showrooms? Atleast it was for the first Acura El . At the time it was priced cheaper than the Integra and we have less disposable income tham American's. I guess it's Canadian in that respect. Is the CSX still only sold in Canada?

Honda offers the Acura CSX only in Canada, rebadged as a Honda is known as the 4 door sedan Civic is sold in the global market along side the Honda 5 door/hatch not sold in North America.
 The Civic which has a the shorter front hood redesigned front clip and rear is sold only in Canada, Mexico, some South American, Caribbean markets and USA.
Honda sells the Acura brand in Canada, USA, Mexico, and China.


So it is possible that the Global Honda Accord (sold as Acura TSX in North America) could be a rebadged Acura TSX, and the Honda Legend a rebadged Acura RL?

All kdding aside, one would think if you googled "Canadian responsible for Acura CSX design" there would be some Canadian site link with an article or two on this accomplishment yes? 

As an example google "Canadian responsible for Volvo C30 design" , you will find links directing you to articles and info on a young man from Quebec  Simon Lamarre.

It is very likely that a Canadian was involved in the modifications or design tweaks made to differenciate the CSX and the Americas Civic, but one would think a Canadian car journalist somewhere in the country would have made mention of this impressive fact. Or at least Honda Canada would have just for the reason or importance that the CSX being marketed as unique to Canada and specially designed for the Canadian consumer would have included this in the CSX media release back in 2006 yes?
Anything worth mentioning in regards to the Canadian auto industry is picked up by most Canadian bloggers, car forums,  auto123, Canadiandriver, wheels.ca, driving.ca etc.

[sirAQUAMAN64]

From what I recall reading from a few years ago, Acura Canada wanted to keep the CSX in their line-up (which I think was a very smart move) and designed (likely had designed for them) some distictive sheetmetal and premium touches to differientiate from the Civic. In the development process, Honda Japan liked the design so much they decided to use it for the Japanese domestic market version. I don't think it's a "Canadian designed" model, but was a model designed and tweeked FOR Canada which turned out being preferred and marketed elsewhere.

There are very few Canadian designed vehicles. The previous generation Chevrolet Equinox / Pontiac Torrent are about as close to the definition in recent memory, with a big chunk of them being designed and engineered in Oshawa, and built in Ingersoll.