Topic: 2010 Toyota Yaris RS Hatch; Day 1

[rrocket]

Anything that weighs ~2000lbs is going to come out on the short end vs something that weighs ~3200lbs...

[Mitlov]

Anything that weighs ~2000lbs is going to come out on the short end vs something that weighs ~3200lbs...

Not always true.  Watch this Renault Modus cut through a Volvo 940 estate like butter.  It's the Modus driver who walks away this time.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86M_fV-1yKY

Given that both the Yaris and the Camry get good marks from the IIHS for crash tests against static barriers, I would have thought that the 2300 versus 3250 lb weight difference would mean that the Camry driver would feel better the next day, but both would still walk away.  As is, it looks like the Yaris driver might end up a double amputee.

[johngenx]

...I don't carry my kids on my motorcycle.

Hence the mindset of continual oneupmanship, and why soccer moms buy H2s to drive their "precious cargo" to school.

Hey, I'm safety minded, but frankly, the Camry has grown into a very large car, and I'm not going to buy big just because they win in a collision.

As for the kids and motorcycles, I was a passenger at a young age, working the throttle when I was in elementary school, and my daughter has done both too.

She walks to school (Gasp!  I wonder how many stalkers per day she manages to escape?), occasionally rides a dirt bike, skis ridiculously steep lines, rock climbs, and the most dangerous thing of all, rides in our Corolla!

Yes, many parents (most of my neighbours) think we're incompetent, lacking concern for the safety of our child, but I grew up learning to take risks and "to live deep and suck out all the marrow of life."  Everyday I am thankful my parents didn't bubble wrap me.

Is driving a Yaris a meaningless risky activity?  No.  The car is an excellent choice for conserving precious resources, both in fuel economy and less material wasted in production and in the landfill someday.  Sometimes a good choice comes with potential not-so-good consequences.  But, sometimes it's possible to compromise and come out ahead.  Hence, our Corolla.  Slightly poorer fuel economy and higher weight than the Yaris (and the gap is quite small in terms of fuel economy!) but a newer design that comes with more safety equipment.

[rrocket]

 Everyday I am thankful my parents didn't bubble wrap me.

Hear hear!!  I agree %1000000 !!!!  Our folks did NOT coddle us in the least.  I had my first dirtbike at 5 (and it went an honest 40mph at least).  My younger brother was 3ish and my older brother was 7.  All 3 of us on bikes...oh and our parents weren't hanging around outside either.  The kept the windows open and only raised an eyebrow if they stopped hearing the wail of the 2 strokes.

My parents were very firm, but fair.

Like you, I'm am most grateful I wasn't raised as a pantywaist (like most kids nowadays it seems)

[Mitlov]

johngenx, I didn't call you incompetent or cast ANY aspersions toward your parenting.  I didn't do anything of the sort.  I'd appreciate it if you'd return the favor by not declaring that every parent who parents differently than you (i.e., me) is "bubble wrapping" their kids.

rrocket, I'm too annoyed by the insinuation that I'm turning my kids into "pantywaists" to type a reasoned response...maybe I'll try again later.

[rrocket]

johngenx, I didn't call you incompetent or cast ANY aspersions toward your parenting.  I didn't do anything of the sort.  I'd appreciate it if you'd return the favor by not declaring that every parent who parents differently than you (i.e., me) is "bubble wrapping" their kids.

rrocket, I'm too annoyed by the insinuation that I'm turning my kids into "pantywaists" to type a reasoned response...maybe I'll try again later.

Wow...big ego much?  I wasn't even talking about you.  I was talking about me...and agreeing with what johngenx said about not being over-coddled.  Odd that you are offended by what I would say even if I WAS talking about you.  Since when do you care about what I think about your child rearing skills?

[Mitlov]

johngenx, I didn't call you incompetent or cast ANY aspersions toward your parenting.  I didn't do anything of the sort.  I'd appreciate it if you'd return the favor by not declaring that every parent who parents differently than you (i.e., me) is "bubble wrapping" their kids.

rrocket, I'm too annoyed by the insinuation that I'm turning my kids into "pantywaists" to type a reasoned response...maybe I'll try again later.

Wow...big ego much?  I wasn't even talking about you.  I was talking about me...and agreeing with what johngenx said about not being over-coddled. 

You were agreeing with johngenx's post, which quoted and responded to my post about what I do and don't do with my kids and attributed to me "the mindset of continual oneupmanship."  Hence my interpretation that you were also talking about my kids with the "pantywaist" comment.

[rrocket]

johngenx, I didn't call you incompetent or cast ANY aspersions toward your parenting.  I didn't do anything of the sort.  I'd appreciate it if you'd return the favor by not declaring that every parent who parents differently than you (i.e., me) is "bubble wrapping" their kids.

rrocket, I'm too annoyed by the insinuation that I'm turning my kids into "pantywaists" to type a reasoned response...maybe I'll try again later.

Wow...big ego much?  I wasn't even talking about you.  I was talking about me...and agreeing with what johngenx said about not being over-coddled. 

You were agreeing with johngenx's post, which quoted and responded to my post about what I do and don't do with my kids.  Hence my interpretation that you were talking about me.

Just go back and look at what part of John's post I was quoting.  You need to relax, man.  Really....I could care less how you raise your kids, as long as they don't inconvenience me any...which is likely never.

The way you got angry there makes me wonder if you'd go off the deep end if another parent said your kid "sucked" during a soccer game or something.  Are you one of those parents who might start a fisticuff by chance?

[johngenx]

johngenx, I didn't call you incompetent or cast ANY aspersions toward your parenting.  I didn't do anything of the sort.  I'd appreciate it if you'd return the favor by not declaring that every parent who parents differently than you (i.e., me) is "bubble wrapping" their kids.

Didn't direct that at you.  FFS, you drive a little Jetta!  I'm talking about where the thinking "got to get me a big vehicle" comes from.  It comes from the growing number of helicopter parents that justify their gargantuan-mobile purchase "in the name of safety for the children."

As for people bubble-wrapping their kids, well, I see the results everyday.  Boys coming into junior high (gr 7) are shockingly overweight thanks to parents that won't kick them outside.  People keep their kids inside now and drive them everywhere out of fear.  Fear of the kids getting hurt.  Fear of predators (Canada has had less than 6 random abductions in the last 20 years.  Yes, nation-wide.) and fear of pretty much everything.  One of the boys in my daughter's grade FIVE class learned to ride a bike LAST YEAR because his parents thought it too dangerous until then.  I can't imagine what was going through their minds as I assisted my daughter in building a jump-ramp in the front yard!!

FEAR!!!  We've got an abundance of it.  Fear of unintended acceleration.  Fear of lightweight, resource sipping cars.  Fear of terrorists.  Fear of predators.  Fear of speeders/street-racers.  Fear of motorcycles and fear of pedal bikes.

Combine those fears with the fear that we're not keeping up with the Jones family, and you can see the results all around.  Everyone clambers to have a bigger house so they can lock themselves inside.  They pray for lower gas prices so they can feed their giant "safe" SUV, that they hope is the largest one on the road today.  People buy multiple video game consoles and other crap to entertain their children, keeping them safe and sound inside their McMansion.  Kids text each other and talk online from the safety of their homes, rarely venturing out.

But, fear has been very good to some people.  Companies have spread this fear, keeping people buying things to soothe their minds.  War profiteers used fear to siphon trillions of dollars from taxpayers.  Fear allows governments to compromise individual rights and expand the powers of police.  Fear means longer prison sentences and prison time for non-violent offenses.  Combine that fear with the privatization of the penal system, and fear = profits.

We need FDR back...

"...the only thing to fear is fear itself..."

[MMMB89]

Is driving a Yaris a meaningless risky activity?  No.  The car is an excellent choice for conserving precious resources, both in fuel economy and less material wasted in production and in the landfill someday.  Sometimes a good choice comes with potential not-so-good consequences.  But, sometimes it's possible to compromise and come out ahead.  Hence, our Corolla.  Slightly poorer fuel economy and higher weight than the Yaris (and the gap is quite small in terms of fuel economy!) but a newer design that comes with more safety equipment.

Exactly and that's why the Corolla outsells the Yaris and the Echo that preceeded it.  For an extra grand or two, you get a larger, safer and more comfortable Corolla without any real penalty for fuel economy.  

If you live in a tight busy urban setting and rarely head into the suburbs or go on long trips, small cars like the Yaris, Accent and Fit make a lot of sense.  However, for people who live in the suburbs and/or do lots of driving, a compact like the Corolla, Elantra or Civic are worth spending the extra grand or two for.

[Mitlov]

The way you got angry there makes me wonder if you'd go off the deep end if another parent said your kid "sucked" during a soccer game or something.  Are you one of those parents who might start a fisticuff by chance?

I'm not the sort who would EVER start a fistfight at a kid's sporting event, but if a grown adult was calling little kids names, you bet I'd have a word with them.

Do I even want to know if you're the sort of adult who would call a little kid names at a pee-wee soccer game? 

[rrocket]

John...I'm thinking that you were raised alot like me.  I see kids now that say "NO!" "Shut up!" to their parents.  If that was me...man...I don't even want to think what would have happened...LOL



Mitlov...why would I ever want to go to a pee wee soccer game??  For starters, soccer is insanely boring.....


I HAVE been in a restaurant and commented to the parents that their child was particularly poorly raised (running around restaurant).  When I left, I gave them a $10 bill and said "this is for a baby sitter next time".

[Ontariodriver]

Meanwhile back at the Yaris debate. 

[Dragon75]

Honda Fit is King    RAWR!!!!!!!!     

[Seafoam]

Honda Fit is King    RAWR!!!!!!!!     

Apparently not anymore. See posts under "Fiesta"

[ArticSteve]

Completely off topic, but could not resist.

Combine that fear with the privatization of the penal system, and fear = profits.

Fantastic point.  When the government privatizes prisons, like the Super Jail run by Corrections Corporation of AMERICA in Ontario, brought to us by the Harris CONS (same ppl that currently run the Harper gov) you know the country is facked.  BTW, Mike Harris pulls in 1 MILLION a year sitting on Corporate Boards.

AS for a loaded Yaris, it's a free market place ppl.  The vehicle NEVER breaks vis-a-vis the simplicity of the unit.  Keep the rust out of it and it will turn 400k km/20 years and the AC will still work!

Oddly, that appeals to some ppl. 

[rrocket]

AS for a loaded Yaris, it's a free market place ppl.  The vehicle NEVER breaks vis-a-vis the simplicity of the unit.  Keep the rust out of it and it will turn 400k km/20 years and the AC will still work!

Oddly, that appeals to some ppl. 

That's proving to be the case with my Echo, that's for sure.  Though I DO have rust cause I didn't bother with it.  I think the body panels on the Echo are about as thick as tinfoil....

[johngenx]

The driveline in the Yaris is proven bullet-proof.  The "old tech" four speed automatic will last almost as long as the engine if maintained, and the engine lasts nearly forever.  The manual transmission needs clutches every 300-400K, otherwise lasts again, virtually forever.

That said, I'm still not that big of a fan.  We considered it carefully when we bought the Corolla.  The Corolla's extra safety features, more refined ride, conventional dash, better resale, and nearly the same fuel economy won the day.  Also, the 2009- Corolla is a newer model, meaning easier resale should the need arise.  When we bought the 'Rolla, the price difference for a Yaris equipped as close as possible to the Corolla was $700.

[rrocket]

I agree.  I think it's a better used car purchase than a new car purchase...

[johngenx]

I agree.  I think it's a better used car purchase than a new car purchase...

Oh, yeah.  One of the few Toyota products that can be had in the used market for a reasonable price.  I'm not usually a new car buyer, but the Corolla's used values were just too high, so we bought new.  The Yaris is a better buy used.  A 2005 Echo can be had for a pretty good price now, so going back to the Echo means even more value.