Topic: First Drive: 2011 Ford Fiesta

[MKII]

Look what's in the engine bay of a2012 Focus at the Beijing Auto Show
http://car.autohome.com.cn/photoshow/76012.html

[MKII]

Here's why things might not be as rosy as we think (and Ford hopes).

 "The Yaris is the hardest hit of the subcompacts in Canada, but there is plenty of pain to go around. In essence, the subcompact car market has collapsed this year (2009) in Canada, says auto analyst Dennis DesRosiers in a note to clients.

Subcompact sales were down 27.9 per cent in September and are off 25.9 per cent for the year.

In sharp contrast to subcompacts, DesRosiers points out that sales of large/luxury/sport vehicles were up 4.1 per cent in September and are down only 6.4 per cent on the year in a market that is off 14.3 percent.

Top 10 cars through September 2009"
 
1) Honda Civic
2) Toyota Corolla
3) Mazda3
4) Hyundai Elantra
5) Hyundai Accent
6) Toyota Yaris
7) Ford Focus
Toyota Matrix
9) Nissan Versa
10) Ford Fusion.

 http://autos.sympatico.ca/Jeremy-Cato-Blog/1643/the-top-10-in-canada





Note that our beloved Honda Fit is nowhere to be seen. As good as it is, it suffers from a premium price tag in a segment that is totally price conscious. Also gas prices have stabilized about 30% below their historic highs, so people have reverted somewhat to old buying habits

The relevant market place in Canada for B-segment cars is Quebec, the rest of Canada B-segment sales are seen as a bonus.
DesRosiers comments can be perceived that in tough times, people with money still have money hence his comment on luxury sales not tanking as bad as other segments, but his numbers still say premium sales are negative. Betcha the premium segment has been flooded with some nice incentives as well the past 12-24 months. With the B-segment the net to profit margin is so small there is not much room for incentives, unless the auto maker wants to move metal at a lose.
And the lower to middle income earners feel the tough times much worse as the higher income earners, hence the larger negative numbers in the B and C segment sales.
Also even though he is trying to paint a doom and gloom of B-segment sales, I notice 3 B segment vehicles are in the top ten.

[Rupert]

Just from on the road observations I thought that there were more Accents out there than Yarises, looks like Hyundai won this one. In Quebec last year it appeared that the Accent and Elantra were very prevalent...only beat out for numbers by the Chrysler van but that is the same every where.

I don't think that this small car market is done by any means and suspect that those who switched down for eccology mostly found that driving a responsive, easy parking car was a dream...not even considering the gas sipping aspects. It was all they needed. Especially so for retirees. It could be that the marketplace is mindful of new versions in the wings and is waiting to replace. I think that quiet highway driving is a very important feature here and although my current little jewel is not bad, I will be looking for an improvment in this department.

I find the shouts for more power a bit rediculous here...where do you go with this. Providing souped up versions to perenial abusers only leads to warrenty claims and one wonders if this leads to any proffits at all. The road is not a race track. Just match the drive train and power to the weight of the car in normal use. No limitations on good suspension.

[Jaeger]

Listening to some of the more vocal domestic fanboys on this site, you can't atrust a word TTAC has to say because they are a bunch of Japanese-loving domestic haters who never give Ford / GM / Chrysler a fair shake.

Well, seems they liked the Fiesta.  I guess that must mean it's crap - can't trust a word they say, after all. 

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/review-2011-ford-fiesta/

This will really throw a wrench into the old, tired, bias rant:

"For the attention-challenged TTACers, here’s your one-sentence review: The Fiesta is as much better than the Honda Fit as said Fit is better than the Toyota Yaris, and for most of the same reasons. Want more details? Here you go. Inside and out, the Fiesta is trimmed and assembled like a decent German entry-luxury car. It’s quiet and fast on the freeway. There are a few ergonomic missteps (where’s the steering-wheel radio volume control?) but from the Vertu-like center console to the tightly assembled instrument panel, this looks and feels like an expensive car. The Fit used to set the standard in this market but it’s not even close to the Fiesta."

Jaeger

[Mitlov]

The B-segment is most definitely not a lost cause!  Here in Oregon, gas just hit $3/gallon and is still climbing.  The reprieve after the last spike (to nearly $5 per gallon) is ending.  There's going to be another wave of small car sales, and people who bought Escalades after the last price spike receded are going to begin whining again.

And as for Canada, sales are down 25% from what?  Luxury SUV sales are up 4.1% from what?  That doesn't mean that luxury SUVs are outselling subcompacts.  To the contrary, by looking at the top ten vehicles, it looks like B-segment cars are the second-best-selling segment in Canada after C-segment cars.  Only one midsizer is on that list, and it's #10.

[Spec5]

The B-segment is most definitely not a lost cause!  Here in Oregon, gas just hit $3/gallon and is still climbing.  The reprieve after the last spike (to nearly $5 per gallon) is ending.  There's going to be another wave of small car sales, and people who bought Escalades after the last price spike receded are going to begin whining again.

And as for Canada, sales are down 25% from what?  Luxury SUV sales are up 4.1% from what?  That doesn't mean that luxury SUVs are outselling subcompacts.  To the contrary, by looking at the top ten vehicles, it looks like B-segment cars are the second-best-selling segment in Canada after C-segment cars.  Only one midsizer is on that list, and it's #10.

Couple really good points there. Although I'd probably put the Ford F150 as the second best selling segment after compact cars!

[tpl]

Listening to some of the more vocal domestic fanboys on this site, you can't atrust a word TTAC has to say because they are a bunch of Japanese-loving domestic haters who never give Ford / GM / Chrysler a fair shake.

Well, seems they liked the Fiesta.  I guess that must mean it's crap - can't trust a word they say, after all. 

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/review-2011-ford-fiesta/

This will really throw a wrench into the old, tired, bias rant:

"For the attention-challenged TTACers, here’s your one-sentence review: The Fiesta is as much better than the Honda Fit as said Fit is better than the Toyota Yaris, and for most of the same reasons. Want more details? Here you go. Inside and out, the Fiesta is trimmed and assembled like a decent German entry-luxury car. It’s quiet and fast on the freeway. There are a few ergonomic missteps (where’s the steering-wheel radio volume control?) but from the Vertu-like center console to the tightly assembled instrument panel, this looks and feels like an expensive car. The Fit used to set the standard in this market but it’s not even close to the Fiesta."

Jaeger

When I go to my Ford dealer to "inspect" a Fiesta I'll take the FIT.   I believe that the Fiesta will be better in everything except cargo carrying.  I'll also believe that if Ford decided to make a Fiesta in a FIT like configuration that they'd learn from the Fit and do it better.    Now there is a thought... a Fiesta station wagon... Fit rear grated onto Fiesta front.

[MKII]

Listening to some of the more vocal domestic fanboys on this site, you can't atrust a word TTAC has to say because they are a bunch of Japanese-loving domestic haters who never give Ford / GM / Chrysler a fair shake.

Well, seems they liked the Fiesta.  I guess that must mean it's crap - can't trust a word they say, after all. 

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/review-2011-ford-fiesta/

This will really throw a wrench into the old, tired, bias rant:

"For the attention-challenged TTACers, here’s your one-sentence review: The Fiesta is as much better than the Honda Fit as said Fit is better than the Toyota Yaris, and for most of the same reasons. Want more details? Here you go. Inside and out, the Fiesta is trimmed and assembled like a decent German entry-luxury car. It’s quiet and fast on the freeway. There are a few ergonomic missteps (where’s the steering-wheel radio volume control?) but from the Vertu-like center console to the tightly assembled instrument panel, this looks and feels like an expensive car. The Fit used to set the standard in this market but it’s not even close to the Fiesta."

Jaeger

When I go to my Ford dealer to "inspect" a Fiesta I'll take the FIT.   I believe that the Fiesta will be better in everything except cargo carrying.  I'll also believe that if Ford decided to make a Fiesta in a FIT like configuration that they'd learn from the Fit and do it better.    Now there is a thought... a Fiesta station wagon... Fit rear grated onto Fiesta front.

The Euro Fusion replacement is in the works  "B-Max" .
B-Max will be the proper comparo to the Fit.

[Mitlov]

When I go to my Ford dealer to "inspect" a Fiesta I'll take the FIT.   I believe that the Fiesta will be better in everything except cargo carrying.  I'll also believe that if Ford decided to make a Fiesta in a FIT like configuration that they'd learn from the Fit and do it better.    Now there is a thought... a Fiesta station wagon... Fit rear grated onto Fiesta front.

Pure speculation, but I'm betting that the suspension and chassis setup of the Fiesta doesn't allow for as much cargo space, or as flat of a load floor, as the Fit does.  Cno car can be everything to all people, and I suspect that this is an issue where you have to compromise one virtue or another.

What I'd like to see are some tests between a Fiesta 5-door and a base-engined Mini Clubman.  All "Mini" rhetoric aside, I want to know if it actually handles any better than the Fiesta or is any more fun to drive.  On the other hand, the Clubman is heavier, less practical, marginally less fuel-efficient, tacky inside and out, cheaper-feeling inside, and far more expensive.

[wing]

I'd think the clubman does handle better.  A lot better?  Hmmm maybe not but there is I am sure a difference.  The Mini is much stiffer in both suspension feel and chassis and I'm sure that makes a big difference.

Also the Fiesta comes with some craptastic tires, put on some stickies and things may be different!

[Mitlov]

Also the Fiesta comes with some craptastic tires, put on some stickies and things may be different!

If a company is going to cut corners to make a price point, I'm glad they do it on tires.  Nothing on a car is easier and cheaper to upgrade than tires.

[aknutson]

Also the Fiesta comes with some craptastic tires, put on some stickies and things may be different!

If a company is going to cut corners to make a price point, I'm glad they do it on tires.  Nothing on a car is easier and cheaper to upgrade than tires.

+1, then I can get some sweet 16" 5-spoke rims at the same time!

[johngenx]

I see the SE level trim has 15" steel wheels.  Perfect.  Slap some snows on those and buy some aftermarket 16's with some decent tires for summer use.  OE alloys are always priced so high, I'd prefer a lower sticker and steels, then add what I want.

[Mitlov]

For those who want more power out of the Fiesta and don't want to wait for an EcoBoost model, Mountune is offering an upgrade kit for the Fiesta that adds 20 horsepower and cuts two seconds off the 0-60 time.  At least in the UK, it's "Ford-approved," so I guess there are no warranty issues and you can get it through a dealer.

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/04/26/ford-uk-gets-new-tarted-up-fiesta-s1600/

The 140PS performance upgrade, for Zetec-S and Titanium 1.6-litre models, consists of a high-flow air induction system, a high performance exhaust system including high-flow catalyst and tubular manifold, and re-calibration of Ford’s 1.6-litre Ti-VCT Sigma engine to produce 140PS at 6750rpm and 170NM at 4250rpm. This boost in performance reduces the standard 0-60mph time from 9.9secs to 7.9secs.
...
The 140PS kit can be fitted to any 1.6 Ti VCT Mk7 Fiesta, new or used, and has a minimum 12 months/12,000-mile warranty without affecting the vehicle warranty.

http://www.mountuneperformance.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=141&Itemid=58

[Dante]

I see the SE level trim has 15" steel wheels.  Perfect.  Slap some snows on those and buy some aftermarket 16's with some decent tires for summer use.  OE alloys are always priced so high, I'd prefer a lower sticker and steels, then add what I want.

Since I don't like the Fiesta 16" wheels, I'd favour this approach, but you lose some other nice touches (nothing essential though).

[safristi]

 ...YES all good and well ......but can it give ya an ORGASM..

[Mitlov]

FordRacing.com already has a page up for the new Fiesta.  Not a ton of stuff yet, but they DO have at least place-holder images for the following mods up:

*  New suspension, including springs, shocks, and rollbars
*  Performance exhaust
*  Short-throw shifter
*  K&N high-flow air filter

A cold-air intake is also on the way, they say.  If the handling is as good as reviewers say, I'd probably slap the Ford Racing exhaust on (I like a pleasant exhaust note) and leave the rest alone. 

http://www.fordracingparts.com/fiesta/

[carsncars]

I'd think the clubman does handle better.  A lot better?  Hmmm maybe not but there is I am sure a difference.  The Mini is much stiffer in both suspension feel and chassis and I'm sure that makes a big difference.

Also the Fiesta comes with some craptastic tires, put on some stickies and things may be different!

Wing, how does the MINI Cooper/Clubman (non-S) compare to the Fiesta, power-wise? They have roughly similar output numbers and similar curb weights--118 hp/114 lb-ft and 2,568 lbs for the MINI and 120 hp/112 lb-ft and 2,537 lbs for the Fiesta. While most reviews I've read of the Fiesta either call it underpowered or just sufficient, I've never heard anyone say that for the MINI--and one would expect reviewers to expect more from the MINI given its price premium.

I'm sure some of it is in the gearing, but on paper I wouldn't expect the difference to be that pronounced.

[rrocket]

FordRacing.com already has a page up for the new Fiesta.  Not a ton of stuff yet, but they DO have at least place-holder images for the following mods up:

*  New suspension, including springs, shocks, and rollbars
*  Performance exhaust
*  Short-throw shifter
*  K&N high-flow air filter

A cold-air intake is also on the way, they say.  If the handling is as good as reviewers say, I'd probably slap the Ford Racing exhaust on (I like a pleasant exhaust note) and leave the rest alone. 

http://www.fordracingparts.com/fiesta/

Wonder if those are the bolt on parts from the UK Fiesta S1600??

[wing]

The regular mini is dog slow