Author Topic: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...  (Read 12609 times)

Offline TopGun

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SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« on: February 03, 2009, 01:27:29 pm »
MotorTrend's title not mine...

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/sports/112_0903_sport_compact_car_comparison/index.html

8th - Dodge Caliber SRT4
7th - Mini Clubman S
6th - Mitsu Lancer Ralliart
5th - Honda Civic Si
4th - Subaru WRX
3rd - MazdaSpeed3
2nd - Chevy Cobalt SS
1st - VW GTI

Offline mrthompson

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2009, 01:42:50 pm »
Discuss... ;D

Offline HeliDriver

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2009, 01:43:48 pm »
Car and Driver came to a similar conclusion a couple issues ago: http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/comparison_test/sedans/cobalt_ss_v_wrx_and_5_more_sport_compacts_comparison_test .

Seventh: '09 Mitsubishi Lancer Ralliart
Sixth: '09 Mini John Cooper Works Clubman
Fifth: '09 Honda Civic Si
Fourth: '09 Subaru Impreza WRX
Third: '09 Chevrolet Cobalt SS
Second: '09 Volkswagen GTI
First: '09 Mazdaspeed 3 Grand Touring

They were also pretty impressed with it on the track in their annual "Lightning Lap" test: http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/hot_lists/high_performance/features_classic_cars/the_lightning_lap_2008_feature+page-2.html

vdk

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2009, 02:08:13 pm »
the turbo SS is one hell of a car..

Offline aquadorhj

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #4 on: February 03, 2009, 03:16:00 pm »
the turbo SS is one hell of a car..

If only it had some decent interior, it would be on my shopping list for next car.

I sat In the new Hyundai elantra touring(wagon) yesterday, and I thought it was pretty good.

By the by, typing this on iPhone sucks. :(

Driving thrills makes my wallet lighter.. and therefore makes me faster because i'm shedding weight... :D

Offline Sir Osis of Liver

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #5 on: February 03, 2009, 03:18:17 pm »
Discuss... ;D


Should be a pretty safe thread. Toyota doesn't have a dog in this hunt! ;D
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Offline mrthompson

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2009, 03:24:56 pm »
You're right.  Perhaps I should move to the Four Cylinder RAV4 thread?  ;D

Offline DockMan

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2009, 04:19:56 pm »
Should be a pretty safe thread. Toyota doesn't have a dog in this hunt! ;D

Ya I can imagine "A.S." was ready to pounce until he read the list. Might've pee'd himself just a little bit before the let-down. ;D
Political extremism involves two prime ingredients: an excessively simple diagnosis of the world's ills, and a conviction that there are identifiable villains back of it all. - John W. Gardner

Offline DriverJeff

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #8 on: February 03, 2009, 04:47:55 pm »
Road and Track also picked the Cobalt as their favourite too. 
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=31&article_id=7103

It's also interesting to note that the older, FWD MazdaSpeed3 places higher than the WRX (265) in most of these tests too.
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Offline rrocket

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #9 on: February 03, 2009, 05:00:40 pm »
I called it one of the best EVER handling FWD cars ever made.....They've been raving about this chassis in the import/sport compact mags months (years?) before the mainstream press clued in...

Too bad the styling is horribly bland and the interior is beyond craptastic.

It's for this reason (the looks) that I prefer the HHR SS.....
How fast is my 911?  Supras sh*t on on me all the time...in reverse..with blown turbos  :( ...

Offline Snowman

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #10 on: February 03, 2009, 05:09:39 pm »
Road and Track also picked the Cobalt as their favourite too. 
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=31&article_id=7103

It's also interesting to note that the older, FWD MazdaSpeed3 places higher than the WRX (265) in most of these tests too.

Nice to see such an abundance of affordable and practical performance cars to choose from, the good old days are now. I like the Mazdaspeed3 but the R&T test did show some of the shortcommings vs. the Cobalt and WRX:

“The Mazdaspeed3 didn't fare as well as we expected around the autocross, finishing about a second behind the WRX and Cobalt SS, despite being able to run most of the course near the thick of its powerband in 2nd gear. "It felt sloppy and needs more front grip for better initial turn-in," Hong said. And we were all surprised by the amount of shudder generated by the front tires through the course's fast slalom section”.

Lets’ hope Subaru resolves the issues with the 1% of new WRX265 owners who have exploded their engines.

Offline rrocket

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2009, 05:13:39 pm »
The AWD of the Subaru makes it the most compelling buy IMO.  Spit on the pavement, and let's watch those FWD high power engine try to lay it down....LOL.....

Those cars are great in nice weather...but come rain or winter....and they are pretty much useless as a performance car whereas with the WRX you can still have some fun on those days...

Cortina

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #12 on: February 03, 2009, 05:16:20 pm »
Honda didn't do a good job this time with SI. Even Clarky Boy wasn't impressed.

Offline johngenx

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #13 on: February 03, 2009, 05:40:17 pm »

Lets’ hope Subaru resolves the issues with the 1% of new WRX265 owners who have exploded their engines.


They had issued a stop-sales order on all 2.5L turbo charged engines for a period to make changes, so I wonder if they feel the issue is resolved?

Offline DriverJeff

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #14 on: February 03, 2009, 10:14:40 pm »

Lets’ hope Subaru resolves the issues with the 1% of new WRX265 owners who have exploded their engines.


They had issued a stop-sales order on all 2.5L turbo charged engines for a period to make changes, so I wonder if they feel the issue is resolved?

According to some posters on NASIOC forums, that stop-sales order was for '08s that had a similarly catastrophic (but different) engine problem.  I want to love that 265, but there seem to be so many issues (not the least of which is an $8000 dearer cost of admission over something like the MS3).

Offline rrocket

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #15 on: February 03, 2009, 10:16:41 pm »

Lets’ hope Subaru resolves the issues with the 1% of new WRX265 owners who have exploded their engines.


They had issued a stop-sales order on all 2.5L turbo charged engines for a period to make changes, so I wonder if they feel the issue is resolved?

According to some posters on NASIOC forums, that stop-sales order was for '08s that had a similarly catastrophic (but different) engine problem.  I want to love that 265, but there seem to be so many issues (not the least of which is an $8000 dearer cost of admission over something like the MS3).

But really?  How many people were affected?  Is this a blown out of proportion thing a la GT-R gearbox where ultimately...16-20 cars were affected??

Are there any reliable figures?

vdk

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #16 on: February 03, 2009, 10:56:12 pm »
"Under certain harsh driving patterns, specifically when repeatedly or continuously operating the engine above the red-line (RPM above 6,700), abnormal combustion could occur resulting in serious internal engine damage in the form of broken piston ring lands. This abnormal combustion condition is the result of an over-lean fuel mixture caused by a combination of fuel cut activation and high turbo boost. To prevent this condition from occurring, Subaru has developed a modification to the Engine Control Module software logic that will improve combustion management above red-line engine speed. This revised logic will not adversely affect peak vehicle performance."


That was the problem with STIs. TSB WVE-15.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2009, 11:20:07 pm by vdk »

Offline rrocket

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #17 on: February 03, 2009, 11:00:26 pm »
^^Ahhh...the dreaded fuel cut defender.  Fuel cut+high boost= BOOM!!!  I put a Greddy BCC (boost cut controller) on the Supra to prevent this.

I wonder how many failures they actually had as a result?  STis aren't plentiful (here anyways).  I'd have to imagine only a handful....

Offline Trainman

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #18 on: February 03, 2009, 11:31:45 pm »
On the Forester forum, quite a few 09 turbo owners are reporting blown engines due to the bearings going.  Also occurred in late production 08 Foresters.  Something to do with a batch of bad bearings that did not get caught.  There was also a stop sales order for these but seems quite a few slipped through.

Back on topic:

As Snowie has noted, these are indeed the good old days   :D
2016 Subaru Forester XT

Offline Erik

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Re: SHOCK: Chevy beats Honda, Mazda, Mini, Subaru...
« Reply #19 on: February 03, 2009, 11:38:00 pm »
Interesting to see they pick the winning performance car by refinement and the quality of it's interior. I guess it is important to enjoy your GTI's interior, since that's where you will be watching the Cobalts taillights disappear into the distance....

"Sure, he maybe be quicker, faster and better handling. But I have better quality plastic in MY interior!"
« Last Edit: February 03, 2009, 11:41:15 pm by Erik »
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