Topic: Mitsubishi Testing Its Cute EV in California

[UmroAyyar]

Mitsubishi is toying with the idea of bringing its jellybean-shaped i MiEV electric car to America and wants two California utilities to put them through their paces and see how they perform in real-world conditions.

The automaker has signed deals with Pacific Gas & Electric and Southern California Edison to add a few i MiEVs to their fleets in October. The three-year demonstration program will test the vehicles' drivetrains, reliability and usage on the grid. It follows similar deals with utility companies in Japan, where the car hits the market next summer.

Tohru Hashimoto, a Mitsubishi executive in the i MiEV program, says its work with the two California utilities "will yield valuable data and a greater appreciation of the practicality of an all-electric vehicle in California."

The four-seater, based on the "i" gasoline-powered cars Mitsubishi sells in Japan, is a little smaller than a Honda Fit. It ditches the 64-horsepower engine in favor of a 47 kW electric motor and 330-volt lithium-ion battery. The battery charges in about 10 to 16 hours plugged into a standard 110 volt electrical outlet like the ones in your house. Plug it into a 220 and it'll charge in six to eight.

Although it doesn't look like much, the motor produces an impressive 63 horsepower and 133 pound-feet of torque. It's said to be a quick and nimble runabout good for zero-to-60 mph in less than 9 seconds and a top speed of 82 mph.   

Mitsubishi says the i MiEV (Mitsubishi Innovative Electric Vehicle) is good for 75 miles on a charge and it wants to test the car in America to see how well a car designed for Japanese city driving does in America. PG&E and SoCal Edison have loads of experience with EVs and plug-in hybrids; SoCal Edison has racked up more than 16 million miles running the nation's largest fleet of EVs.

"Partnering with automakers like Mitsubishi is vital to developing compatible infrastructures to support electric vehicles in the marketplace and ensure responsible integration with the grid," says Andrew Tang, senior director of the smart energy web for PG&E. "By working with Mitsubishi, we will both benefit from a free exchange of electric vehicle information that includes charging infrastructure availability, vehicle data, vehicle commercialization expectations and public feedback."

Mitsubishi isn't the only automaker lining up with utilities to lay the groundwork for what some consider the inevitable electrification of the automobile. Both Ford and General Motors are working with the Electric Power Research Institute -- the R&D arm of the utility industry --  to address issues ranging from tax incentives on what promise to be pricey cars to guaranteeing drivers can charge them easily without sparking a citywide blackout.

Mitsubishi plans to offer the i MiEV in Japan next summer for about $25,000. There's no word on when it's coming to the U.S., but it's worth noting the decision to offer them to Japanese buyers came shortly after Mitsubishi began working with seven major utilities.

http://blog.wired.com/cars/2008/08/mitsubishi-test.html

[The Mighty Duck]

Good news, but I'd be more interested to see how an EV does in a winter climate like Ontario.  We know they'll work in California, what about those places with -20 (or worse) winters?

[dr_spock]

Chemical reactions slow down in relation to temperature.  Its range will probably be less in the cold Canadian winter.   

[Serniter]

Use a 'block' heater then?

$25000 (US) isn't too much for that car? Also, the minimum six hour recharge is too slow.

Still, looks most like the future automobile.

[Snowman]

Use a 'block' heater then?

$25000 (US) isn't too much for that car? Also, the minimum six hour recharge is too slow.

Still, looks most like the future automobile.

Duh….there is no “block” to heat as there is no water jacket or oil reservoir to keep warm. Also a heater will be required to warm the passenger compartment that will cause more draw on the cold batteries. EV’s will not work in cold climates.

[dr_spock]

Maybe he was referring to a battery warming type blanket.

Hook up the car to a bunch of dogs and you're good to go in Canada.   Who needs heat in the cabin?   Wear an extra layer or two of clothes and fur.   

[rrocket]

Also, the minimum six hour recharge is too slow.

Really?  The car sits in the garage all night while you're asleep. 6 hours is too slow?  For a commuter vehicle or for running errands this car is fine (as is the charge time).  Most people who run errands or drive to work will be well within the range of this car.  For long road trips..not so much.

I'd be all over this car...except the price of admission is a bit steep.  I'd be FAR more interested in the regular gas "I" which gets 55 MPG...for alot less dough...

[Snowman]

Not everybody has a garage and you need substantial heat to defrost the glass and warm up the interior during start up. Then you have to maintain heat to keep the glass dry on the inside and passengers warm while moving in the cold air.  Not going to happen at any economic scale in Canada.

[rrocket]

^^I agree..that's why this car isn't for everybody....just like no everyone needs a 4x4, a sports car, or a uber-luxury sedan.

[dr_spock]

I think it could work in crowded warmer winter cities like Vancouver.   Probably not at places like Flin Fon.  It would help air quality. 

[Serniter]

It would be cool to have a facility to 'defrost' while still plugged in before use. Sort of like remote starters. Flick a switch an hour before you actually need the car and the car begins to warm from current off the grid. That would take a load off batteries.

Six hours is long if this vehicle is intended to replace current gasoline cars. It makes the grade as a commuter and grocery getter, but only just. You may not be able to visit the next town and get back on one charge. For example, you can't drive from Detroit to Ann Arbor and back!

I was actually referring to the battery pack as 'block'. Should've been clearer.

[The Mighty Duck]

I don't think anyone is suggesting EVs will replace gasoline vehicles, at least not without a massive technological breakthrough in battery technology.  But many families own two vehicles, and replacing one with an EV would save a lot of fuel, while leaving a gasoline vehicle in the garage for longer trips.

Apparently the hybrid versions of the Chevrolet Tahoe and Chrysler Aspen get in the 10L/100km range.  A family with an EV and a hybrid Tahoe would have a very practical garage, while still sipping (relatively) at the pumps.  10L/100km is in the same ballpark as the Accord, and many othre "mid-size" cars...

[Snowman]

I think it could work in crowded warmer winter cities like Vancouver.   Probably not at places like Flin Fon.  It would help air quality. 

Replacing exhaust from automobiles with the additional capacity on the power grid that is mostly generated by oil, coal, and natural gas will not helping air quality significantly

[dr_spock]

Vancouver is mostly supplied by hydro power.  They have one thermal generator.

http://www.bchydro.com/info/system/system15277.html

I think it is easier to control and scrub the exhaust from one source than millions of little sources.  They can always build a taller chimney to send the smoke to the next province. 

The cars could be recharged during off peak hours over night.  Off peak may not require additional capacity on their power grid.  Have recharger with a start timer and be ready to go in the morning.

[initial_D]

Count me out. Not a believer in EVs.

[G35X]

“…what about those places with -20 (or worse) winters?…”
“Its range will probably be less in the cold Canadian winter…”   
The car is said to have a range of 160kms per full charge. Even if it gets reduced to 80kms at –20 degrees, still it is better than the Chevy Volt.  Besides, the battery warms itself up during the process of charging and discharging.

“the minimum six hour recharge is too slow…”
That’s when you use 110V household AC outlet.  Most NA homes have 220V supply for cooking stoves (and clothes dryer).  This should shorten the charging time to 3 to 4 hours.  Besides, Mitsu and Tokyo Electric Power Company already developed a quick charging system with which you can charge 60km worth of energy in 10 minutes. I think this is the system they will be testing at Pacific Gas & Electric and Southern California Edison.

”a heater will be required to warm the passenger compartment that will cause more draw on the cold batteries…”
Yes, indeed.  Also, you will need an AC and defroster. Probably they will draw as much as 2kW of power.  If your commuting time is 30 minutes, that’s 1kWh of energy.  This is not insignificant amount, but manageable with the 16kWh battery.

“Replacing exhaust from automobiles with the additional capacity on the power grid that is mostly generated by oil, coal, and natural gas will not helping air quality significantly…”
Contrary to what we were led to believe there is a plenty of surplus energy in the grid system.  Capacity of the grid system is so designed that it can meet the highest possible peak demand.  Other times the difference (surplus) is mostly wasted. You cannot micromanage the supply to meet the demand (payload) exactly, and you cannot keep the energy for future use (other than pumping up water back to reservoir or spinning high-speed flywheels).  We do not have economically viable battery or capacitor for this purpose yet.  This is the reason why hydro companies offer reduced rate during off-peak hours. That’s better than total waste.  So, charging electric vehicle does not increase use of coal and other energy sources at least for the foreseeable future.

P.S. To see an example of supply and demand situation click on the following (California Independent System Operator’s web site):
http://www.caiso.com/outlook/outlook.html

If only we can shave the peak and fill the valley with the shaving, we will be able to save a lot of energy.

[safristi]

Hell this is the Fiftieth TIME I've had to say this...THEY HAVE HAD CHEAP OFF PEAK ELECTRICITY in Euroland fer 30 Plus years (it's still fackin' expensive tho"!!! )...we in Nord Americanus are still tawkin' bout IT!!!!...........the VOLT is a JOKE as are the other electics till some Genius fixes the Battery issue (and then only fer temperate ZONES) so shut tha fack up aboot it till then IF EVER!!!...or I'll regale ya about my fusion fly_back_paks that produce alcohol as a bye product...Sheesh ..Dreaming Does NOT make it so..................and the latest info is clean air leads to more Global warming as the SUN gets a straight shot at Ya!!!! careful wot ya wish fer....

[tpl]

I suggest that an EV  might work in Canada with the addition of a baby diesel tucked away in the car that will keep the battery charged.  Sure it would not be a pure EV. You would NOT have the diesel driving the wheels, just driving an efficient generator.   I bet that a 250cc engine would be enough ( 1 or 2 cylinder, governed, turbocharged).   Advantages:   If you can't plug it in , at work say, just leave the diesel running... assuming outdoors parking.   No access to power at home... the park on the street that's common in the older city cores, leave the diesel running. Let the onboard computers decide on that.
Stuck in a 6 hour traffic jam at -20.  then the diesel runs.
Disadvantages:   You have to remember to fill the diesel tankand service the motor.   Not totally pollution free.

maybe not a diesel, maybe an ethanol optimized "gas"engine.     Even a Stirling cycle engine.


EVs and complex hybrids will not be cheap  but I'd bet that the days of cheap cars are gone forever anyway, be it carbon taxes, $200/barrel oil or the greenies getting elected.

[EV Dan]

".....and the latest info is clean air leads to more Global warming as the SUN gets a straight shot at Ya!!!! careful wot ya wish fer.."

The sun has no choice but to shine over a comb-over. If its energy was consumed by forests to produce more oxygen and get rid of CO2 and the rest of light fell on solar panels we would have been talking about global freezing just about now. Instead we built black asphalt roads and black rooftops and figured a 10% internal combustion engine efficiency would take us from A to B; who cares if one can fry a pizza on it along the way.

@ nay sayers:
there were always folks who'd say: the earth is flat, (well it maybe round bot the sun goes around it); man cannot fly; a lightbulb will never work, a metal boat will sink, a plane needs a propeller,  nobody will ever waste time on posting.. you get the idea.

[TopGun]

@ nay sayers:
there were always folks who'd say: the earth is flat...

Excellent comments DY...they sound like many of my customers...

".....and the latest info is clean air leads to more Global warming as the SUN gets a straight shot at Ya!!!! careful wot ya wish fer.."

Well that's the FIRST time I've heard the argument that pollution is good for us...I must have missed the first 49 times...that ignore button works well.