Topic: Honda NSX

[The Mighty Duck]

The NSX only sold well in the first year after that sales slowly declined until it was killed-off in 2005. There was several reasons the NSX didn't do well:
1. Price at the end was $140,000 CAD,
2. Engine was a V6 with "only" 290HP / 224 ft-lbs torque
3. People buying cars in this price range want a "horsie" emblem on the front hood, so they can show-off to their friends. Honda doesn't have that kind of brand image, no matter how good it was.

You're assuming cause and effect.  You say people didn't want to spend $140 000 on an Acura.  I disagree - people didn't want to spend $140 000 on an Acura with a 290 hp V6, that looked nearly the same as a model 15 years older.

If the 2004 NSX had had a race-tuned V8 with 450 hp, I'm confident it would have sold.  Look at Audi, who by asking $140 000 for the R8 made it their most expensive model.  They're a company who have never sold a supercar, and thus do not have the "pedigree" of Ferrari or Lambo, but at $140k they sell plenty of R8s.  Honda, with the legacy of the last NSX behind them, will be able to move their new supercar.

[rrocket]

^^Agreed...With a F1-type V10?  Will sell pretty easily I would think....

[vdk]

I'd still pick the Maserati... that GT is freakin drop dead gorgeous... 

$120k ain't so bad for the NSX... but idk... a Honda supercar? Umm... 

[rrocket]

.. but idk... a Honda supercar? Umm... 

Yea...a company with vast F1 experience probably doesn't know anything about supercars....

[The Mighty Duck]

Those who roll their eyes at a Honda supercar are little more than badge whores.  The fact is, Honda has a staggering technical know-how based on a very successful race history behind it, and they are more than capable of building a supercar to rival the best from Europe.

It's funny - badge-obsession seems to be a largely North American thing.  Europe loves its bizarre little car companies: Noble, Koenigsegg, and Zonda all enjoy success over there, but this side of the pond rarely hears of them.  If a couple guys in a shop in England can build a world-class supercar, why can't the world's number one engine manufacturer?

[tpl]

Do Noble, Zonda and Co  bother to certify cars for NA at all?  I would have thought that meeting EU regs was enough work for a small car company. 

[Jameel]

You're assuming cause and effect.  You say people didn't want to spend $140 000 on an Acura.  I disagree - people didn't want to spend $140 000 on an Acura with a 290 hp V6, that looked nearly the same as a model 15 years older.

If the 2004 NSX had had a race-tuned V8 with 450 hp, I'm confident it would have sold.  Look at Audi, who by asking $140 000 for the R8 made it their most expensive model.  They're a company who have never sold a supercar, and thus do not have the "pedigree" of Ferrari or Lambo, but at $140k they sell plenty of R8s.  Honda, with the legacy of the last NSX behind them, will be able to move their new supercar.

If that was the case why did sales steadily drop-off after 1991.  Bye 95-96 how many NSXs where being sold?

Honda handled the NSX terribly, I think they rested on the fact it was Aluminum and designed by an F1 driver.  And never really developed it more than that.  I agree if the NSX had a V8 from the beginning it would have done a lot better.

Yes but Audi, still has more "badge snobbery" compared to Honda. I know it sounds stupid, but a lot of non-car enthusiast / general public think that way.

I'd still pick the Maserati... that GT is freakin drop dead gorgeous... 

$120k ain't so bad for the NSX... but idk... a Honda supercar? Umm... 

This is the point I'm trying to prove.  This is how most people think, why get a Honda for $120K when I can get a Maserati GT / Qutraportto for the same price.  And I'd have to agree in this case, that Maserati is a beautiful Grand Tourer.

[Triple Bob]

Do Noble, Zonda and Co  bother to certify cars for NA at all?  I would have thought that meeting EU regs was enough work for a small car company. 

You can get Nobles and Atoms in the US, not sure about Zonda's but I reckon they would available too.

http://www.nobleperformance.net/

http://www.arielatom.com/

Personally I think the NSX was great when it first came out, but just didn't develop as those around it got sleeker, faster, and better looking.  The new one will be awesome, but you sort of feel they should have done this a few years ago.  If anything it should be a very reliable supercar, which should win it some fans.

[tpl]

I suspect that the Canadian regs would count the Noble as a kit car even after it was assembled as the ORIGINAL manufacturer does not certify a fully built car as meeting Canadian regulations. As for the Atom... I am sure our Bureacrats would find some way....

[Jameel]

I suspect that the Canadian regs would count the Noble as a kit car even after it was assembled as the ORIGINAL manufacturer does not certify a fully built car as meeting Canadian regulations. As for the Atom... I am sure our Bureacrats would find some way....

Actually there is a road-legal Atom running around Toronto. A lawyer owns it.

[tpl]

Weird.    All the perfectly good and safe cars that we can't import because of crap about bumpers/drls/kid seat tethers and someone managed to import an Atom and, presumably, register it. 

If an Evo 9 can't come in 'cos of its bumper how does an Atom come in without one at all.... is this a loophole ?

[safristi]

..ATOM........SMASHING.............. ...maybe we could land one on Sudbury........

[vdk]

.. but idk... a Honda supercar? Umm... 

Yea...a company with vast F1 experience probably doesn't know anything about supercars....

Now don't put words in my mouth... I didn't say anything about Honda's F1 experience... and all I meant was that it sounds awkward...

Are you seriously comparing Noble, Koenig and Zonda with Honda? They're all low production vehicles, Hondas you see everyday...

"Hey, I saw a Zonda today"
"WOW!"

"Hey, I saw a Honda today"
"Uh?"

And remember that not everyone out there knows where their oil dipstick is... not to mention what the difference between a V6 and an I6 is...

[Thinking Out Loud]

It's funny - badge-obsession seems to be a largely North American thing.  Europe loves its bizarre little car companies: Noble, Koenigsegg, and Zonda all enjoy success over there, but this side of the pond rarely hears of them.  If a couple guys in a shop in England can build a world-class supercar, why can't the world's number one engine manufacturer?

I was recently in the Bahamas (Nassau) and, as is usually the case, taking notice of the cars Toyota / Honda / Nissan et all sell under different names. 

Not surprised at the number of easily recognizable Lexus and Acura vehicles all carrying their more 'pedestrian' parents names and logos on their trunk lids and aluminum-rim inserts.

The only Toy-onda etc vehicles labelled in N/A fashion were left hand drive imports......

[The Mighty Duck]

Koenigsegg and Noble are both available in the States (Nobles are officially kit cars, though).  Not sure about Zonda.  But the point remains, if people will buy supercars from tiny companies few people have ever heard of, why wouldn't they buy a supercar from the world's number one engine manufacturer?

Right - because Honda supercar "sounds awkward".  Those are the kind of badge whores who aren't going to appreciate the car for what it is, anyway, and frankly, I'm not at all concerned if they don't buy it.  The NSX will be a car to be driven, like a Ferrari, not a car to be seen in, like a Lamborghini. 

[Triple Bob]

This Lamborghini is certainly driven...



I don't know why people think that all supercar owners just cruise around in them.    Most are driven pretty hard.  If anything it's Ferrari's that become garage queens more than most.

[rrocket]

I don't know why people think that all supercar owners just cruise around in them.    Most are driven pretty hard. 

Because that's they way it is in NA.  But prior to that, these cars used to break down a fair amount, and driving them hard made it worse.  So rather than spend huge $$$$, people saved them as garage queens.  Quality has come up ALOT on these cars now and they can be daily driven/tracked with little issue.

But most people (here anyways) just use them as status symbols rather than track weapons...

[The Mighty Duck]

Good tracks are also relatively hard to come by out here...  there's only one decent track on the island, and afaik only one really good track in all of BC.  :/

[Mitlov]

The NSX will be a car to be driven, like a Ferrari, not a car to be seen in, like a Lamborghini. 

That would be the same Ferrari that just released the red carpet special, power-hardtop-convertible California?  Yeah, I'm SURE Californias will see more track time, on average, than Gallardos 

[The Mighty Duck]

It's not a matter of how they're driven by consumers, but what they're built for.  Ferrari has long built cars for the track: they're driver's cars, which were engineered to go fast - they are supercars.  Lambos, until recently perhaps, went fast, but they were built to be seen: consider the insane bodywork of a Countach or Diablo, or even the Reventon.

That is not to say a Lambo is not a fun car to drive, but if you want a pure, proper driving experience, the Ferrari is likely the better car.