Author Topic: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg  (Read 57515 times)

pdude

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2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« on: May 21, 2008, 12:15:51 pm »
These epa number are quite disappointing in my opinion, I was expecting high 30's for city and mid to high 40's for the hwy.  What do you guys think?  I may still get one next spring, but I'm not as excited anymore...
 ???

http://www.autoblog.com/2008/05/21/official-epa-numbers-posted-for-the-09-jetta-tdi-30-41mpg/


Offline mmret

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #1 on: May 21, 2008, 12:39:12 pm »
If it is MPG (US) then thats 5.7 L / 100km on the highway, which isn't so bad is it?

City number of 7.8 for 30MPG(US)
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Offline quadzilla

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #2 on: May 21, 2008, 12:50:39 pm »
The numbers aren't bad but not great either. Personally I was hoping for better hwy, will still wait for some real world number to start showing up.

The '09 Rolla is rated at....

City: 7.5 L/100 km (38 mpg Imp)
Hwy: 5.6 L/100 km (50 mpg Imp)

The '08 Matrix is rated at...

City: 8.0 L/100 km (35 mpg Imp)
Hwy: 6.0 L/100 km (47 mpg Imp)

So is the Jetta is probably the most fuel efficient wagon you can buy on the market today.

Offline rrocket

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #3 on: May 21, 2008, 04:50:42 pm »
Not nearly as impressive as it could be for a diesel...
How fast is my 911?  Supras sh*t on on me all the time...in reverse..with blown turbos  :( ...

Offline johngenx

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #4 on: May 21, 2008, 05:06:22 pm »
We've been getting 7.2-7.5L/100km in 100% city driving in our 09 'Rolla, and on one 1000km highway trip, on a variety of highways (90-110km/h and out and back on the same route, so no elevation effect) we managed 5.4L/100km, or only slightly better than the TC ratings.

With respect to the other cars we've owned over the last 10-12 years, I've found the TC ratings deadly accurate for us, so I look at them carefully when considering cars.  The new TDi seems a little disappointing considering that the 1.8L gasoline Toyota matches/beats it.

BUT, if you love the VW, that is WAY better than the 2.5L engine...

vdk

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #5 on: May 21, 2008, 06:25:44 pm »
Pretty interesting... I've heard of 2.0s getting into the 4s on the highway in Europe...
And the old TDIs got better than EPA on the highway as far as I know, maybe someone can pitch in here..

 :-\

Offline johngenx

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #6 on: May 21, 2008, 06:58:48 pm »
Hey, wait a minute.  Those TDi ratings are US.  They are pessimistic compared to the Canadian ones.  Perhaps the TDi can best the Corolla?  I bet it can.  Of course, it's 30-50% more $$ too, so if you're actually trying to save money, the few L/100km points that the Jetta is better than either Corolla or Matrix will take many years to overcome the difference in initial vehicle cost.

Offline rrocket

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #7 on: May 21, 2008, 07:03:48 pm »
41 US MPG= 5.73L/100km
30 US MPG= 7.83L/100km

Like I said...not terribly impressive....(for a diesel)
« Last Edit: May 21, 2008, 07:10:10 pm by rrocket »

Offline sixer

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #8 on: May 21, 2008, 07:22:14 pm »
With VW reliability, escalating diesel prices due to higher worldwide demand (and it will keep increasing), I wouldn't touch it.

We need more electric vehicles.  Diesel is not the answer.

Offline johngenx

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #9 on: May 21, 2008, 07:31:51 pm »
41 US MPG= 5.73L/100km
30 US MPG= 7.83L/100km

Like I said...not terribly impressive....(for a diesel)

What I mean is that the US gov't agency ratings are usually much worse than the TC ratings, and I bet that the Jetta's Canadian ratings are much better.  Since I have found that in my diving conditions, I usually match or slightly beat the TC ratings, I bet the Jetta is actually better than the Corolla.  How much?  Probably not a ton...

But again, for VW buyers, what a great alternative to the fairly thirsty 2.5

vdk

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #10 on: May 21, 2008, 09:10:53 pm »
With VW reliability, escalating diesel prices due to higher worldwide demand (and it will keep increasing), I wouldn't touch it.

We need more electric vehicles.  Diesel is not the answer.

Diesel is the better way... the 2.0TDI has been out for quite some time now (5 yrs or so IIRC). Thing is the Golf is the one of the best selling cars in Euroland... and a huge percentage of those Golfs come with the 2.0TDI engine. It's a proven engine, I don't think reliability would be an issue. The Jetta's in its fourth year, and the engine's not even new.

And even with the escalating fuel prices and the price difference between regular and diesel, the TDi would be a lot cheaper to drive than my 2.5. TDIs also have higher resale values.

I think diesel is the answer, at least the short term answer.

Offline rrocket

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #11 on: May 21, 2008, 09:20:17 pm »
^^^^Of course diesel is a better choice than that 2.5...which isn't terribly frugal.

What we are saying is the mileage isn't very impressive for a diesel when some gasoline engines come very, very close in mileage..if not better...

Offline Ex-airbalancer

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #12 on: May 21, 2008, 09:23:36 pm »
With VW reliability, escalating diesel prices due to higher worldwide demand (and it will keep increasing), I wouldn't touch it.

We need more electric vehicles.  Diesel is not the answer.

Diesel is the better way... the 2.0TDI has been out for quite some time now (5 yrs or so IIRC). Thing is the Golf is the one of the best selling cars in Euroland... and a huge percentage of those Golfs come with the 2.0TDI engine. It's a proven engine, I don't think reliability would be an issue. The Jetta's in its fourth year, and the engine's not even new.

And even with the escalating fuel prices and the price difference between regular and diesel, the TDi would be a lot cheaper to drive than my 2.5. TDIs also have higher resale values.

I think diesel is the answer, at least the short term answer.
I do not believe this is the same engine, as it has to be tear 2 bin 5 for emissions

vdk

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #13 on: May 21, 2008, 09:48:48 pm »
Yes it is, it only has minor changes to pass the emissions. I'd think different cat and ECU stuff... The engine itself, it's not new.

Mitlov

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #14 on: May 21, 2008, 11:02:39 pm »
When looking at those fuel economy numbers, be sure to compare apples to apples.  You can't compare US EPA numbers with Canadian or European numbers, because the agencies test differently.  The EPA is currently the most pessimistic (realistic?) rating agency on the planet, I think.  So here are the EPA numbers for four potential competitors:

2009 Jetta TDI 6MT:  30 mpg city, 41 mpg highway.
2009 Corolla 1.8 5MT: 26 mpg city, 35 mpg highway.
2009 Matrix 1.8 5MT: 26 mpg city, 32 mpg highway.
2009 Acura TSX 6MT: 20 mpg city, 28 mpg highway.
2008 Toyota Prius: 48 mpg city, 45 mpg highway.

The Jetta TDI gets better fuel economy than everything but the Prius, and nearly matches the Prius on the highway.  That said, if all you care about is saving money, you're probably still best off with a Corolla/Matrix, because (1) the initial price will be FAR less, (2) regular gas is cheaper than diesel, and (3) VWs have higher long-term running costs than Toyotas.  If what you want to do is save money, nothing compares with a lightweight car with a simple, small, modestly-powered gas engine.  Not hybrids, not diesels.

So why would anyone get this instead of a Corolla or Matrix?  Two reasons:

1.  BIODIESEL

I don't know how popular biodiesel is in Canada, but it's a big deal around here.  Try finding a MkIV Jetta TDI or Golf TDI in Oregon without a biodiesel sticker.  Go ahead.  I dare ya.  I think that biodiesel and electricity are going to be the two next big things.  Electricity (whether plug-in hybrids or straight-up electric cars) make a lot of sense in the city.  Biodiesel makes a lot of sense in rural areas and smaller towns, because it performs well on the highway and it works well with midsize and large cars, pickups, big rigs, and agricultural equipment.  Electricity excels with compact cars, subcompacts, and scooters--more metropolitan options.

2.  SUBJECTIVE APPEAL

A Corolla may transport people just as effectively as a Jetta, but the subjective feel is night and day.  I'm not saying that those Teutonic intangibles are better than what the Civic/Corolla/Mazda3 offer--some people (including my mother) really like that "Corolla" feel--but they're sure as hell different.  And some people, myself included, want a car with that certain German X-factor--the certain flavor of steering feel, suspension tuning, firm seats, and overall interior feel that makes a Jetta feel so darned different from other compact non-luxury cars.  Honestly, I think a Jetta feels more like a TSX inside than it does a Civic (especially at upper trim levels), which is why I listed the TSX above as one potential competitor.

Another part of that subjective appeal is a diesel's torque.  The Jetta makes 140 hp and 236 ft-lbs.  The Corolla 1.8 makes 132 hp, 128 ft-lbs.  Now, diesels don't make superb 0-60 times (perhaps due to turbo lag off the line?) but that 236 ft-lbs is going to feel a whole lot different on back roads and during highway passing maneuvers than 128 ft-lbs.  It doesn't make it an objectively-better people mover, but once again, the subjective driving experience is night and day. 
« Last Edit: May 21, 2008, 11:21:24 pm by Mitlov »

Offline Serniter

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #15 on: May 21, 2008, 11:20:54 pm »
One of the reasons early diesels used to post low 0-60 times was a narrow power band. The TDIs have a broader power band and are closer now to gas engines. 

Offline rrocket

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #16 on: May 21, 2008, 11:21:33 pm »
So you think 41MPG is good for a modern diesel??  Ummm...Ok then.  That's what my argument has been.  It's just no impressive.  My POS 8 year old Echo gets better mileage....
« Last Edit: May 21, 2008, 11:26:09 pm by rrocket »

Offline Serniter

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #17 on: May 21, 2008, 11:35:18 pm »
Your Echo is also lighter. You'd want to compare the efficiency with a car of similar weight ex. TSX.

Offline rrocket

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #18 on: May 21, 2008, 11:41:05 pm »
Oh it's true I am lighter...but 41MPG for a modern diesel just isn't impressive to me...Sorry.  And I'm a HUGE diesel fan (mainly because of the TQ).  But c'mon...41MPG just doesn't do it for me.  I'm excited to see what kind of mileage the new Legacy diesel puts up...

Mitlov

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Re: 2009 JETTA TDI 30/41 mpg
« Reply #19 on: May 21, 2008, 11:47:13 pm »
So you think 41MPG is good for a modern diesel??  Ummm...Ok then.  That's what my argument has been.  It's just no impressive.  My POS 8 year old Echo gets better mileage....

And does your Echo offer the size and solid feeling of a MkV Jetta?  Does it offer 238 ft-lbs?  That's an apples and oranges comparison.

I think 41 mpg is good for a car as large, substantial, and respectably fast as a MkV Jetta (which for the record is about the size of a previous-generation Passat).  It would not impress me in a Polo, for example.  Likewise, I think 32 mpg is pretty damn impressive in an E320 Bluetec, but it wouldn't impress me in a MkV Jetta with 140 hp, 238 ft-lbs.  You can't say whether X mpg is "good for a diesel" or not without describing the size, substantiality, and speed of the car.