Topic: Cobalt XFE.... best in class Highway Economy

[rrocket]

Canadian MPG is higher number than US MPG....

[Mitlov]

God knows there's no reasoning with Barrie, drederick, steve, and rrocket when a GM versus Toyota penis-fencing contest breaks out, so I'll try to keep this short:

(1)  It says "best in class."  The Cobalt is a compact.  The Civic, Sentra, Corolla, and Focus are compacts.  The Fit, Yaris, Echo, Versa, and Mini Cooper are subcompacts and have no place in this thread.  Different class.  The Clubman is arguable, I guess, but I still always considered it a subcompact instead of a compact.

(2)  "Xylophone" starts with an X.  "Extreme" starts with an E.  When I am appointed Supreme Grand Dictator of North America, anyone who does not strictly adhere to these rules shall be forced to sit in a kindergarten-sized desk twelve hours per day until they admit the error of their ways.

(3)  Low rolling resistance tires suck monkey balls.  That is all.

[barrie1]

Leave me off this list as I haven' said a word. I already know they are the better vehicle on the list anyways so I'll just sit back and watch the rest of you hash it out. I'd take a Cobalt anyday with the big engine and the SS package as well. I am not fond of Interference engines or imported ones that much at all which is why I go this route. 

[rrocket]

(1)  It says "best in class."  The Cobalt is a compact. 

WRONG.  Go to EPA's web site, or Ministry's site in Canada, and they both list the Cobalt as a SUBCOMPACT.  Thank you come again!!

(MotorTrend also listed the Cobalt in a "Subcompact" Shootout if that matters)

[Mitlov]

(1)  It says "best in class."  The Cobalt is a compact. 

WRONG.  Go to EPA's web site, or Ministry's site in Canada, and they both list the Cobalt as a SUBCOMPACT.  Thank you come again!!

(MotorTrend also listed the Cobalt in a "Subcompact" Shootout if that matters)

Wow...that makes no sense to me.  I definitely consider the Cobalt to be a Focus/Civic/Corolla competitor instead of a Fit/Yaris competitor, and I suspect that most consumers do too.

Those fun-loving bureacrats at the EPA also classify the Sonata as a "large car", even though people cross-shop it with midsizers like the Camry and Accord and Altima instead of cross-shopping it with the Ford 500, Toyota Avalon, and Buick Lucerne...whatever their classification system is, it sometimes comes up with bizarre results.  And don't get me started about their classification of the Magnum as a "sport utility vehicle"...that's why I don't look to the EPA for a definitive determination of what class a vehicle is in.

PS.  I hate Motor Trend, in general.

[rrocket]

^^^^I was just saying.....


I THINK (I'm not sure) they come to their conclusion based on overall interior space.  I seem to recall the new Elantra getting bumped to "midsize" because of the interior volume.  I don't think it has anything to do with wheelbase, weight, etc...

[The Mighty Duck]

I seem to recall some manufacturers tweaking their vehicles to fit into different classes, too.  Like calling their small SUVs "trucks" to get around various fuel economy and safety standards...  am I imagining that?

Sounds like GM's claim is true on paper, but in the real world it's just a game of smoke and mirrors.  Make the whole thing convoluted enough and someone can make a case that they're right...

[Serniter]

The Sonata and Accord are 'large' while Camry is still 'mid-size'.

[KRS]

Wow...that makes no sense to me.  I definitely consider the Cobalt to be a Focus/Civic/Corolla competitor instead of a Fit/Yaris competitor, and I suspect that most consumers do too.

Those fun-loving bureacrats at the EPA also classify the Sonata as a "large car", even though people cross-shop it with midsizers like the Camry and Accord and Altima instead of cross-shopping it with the Ford 500, Toyota Avalon, and Buick Lucerne...whatever their classification system is, it sometimes comes up with bizarre results.  And don't get me started about their classification of the Magnum as a "sport utility vehicle"...that's why I don't look to the EPA for a definitive determination of what class a vehicle is in.

 I just noticed that Natural Resources Canada list the Aston Martin DB9, Infiniti G37 and BMW 650i As subcompacts but one model of the Chevy Aveo is listed as a compact.  Certainly not a lot of cross shopping potential between the DB9 and a Cobalt.

 In any event I take this to mean that Chevrolet in the USA has retested the Cobalt with some mods and got a better EPA rating as a result. I don't think, given the slow rate at which Governments tend to update websites, that I would expect the revised rating to appear on the government site nearly as fast as Chevrolet is announcing it. Also there is no guarantee that the improved rating with the EPA will result in an improved Rating on the NRC site as Chevrolet will need to retest to Canadian methodology in a Canadian spec car (with those heavy Bumpers ) so this may be irrelevant to Canadians.

  Still Chevrolet has made some amazing improvements, especially in their larger cars in the area of fuel economy and I do feel that if Chevrolet does manage on a retest of a Cobalt to match or exceed the 53 mpg highway rating of the 08 Corolla then they deserve Kudos. While the Cobalt may be listed as a subcompact and some may think it should get better mileage the a Corolla as a compact, Toyota's Yaris is a subcompact and for highway Mileage it can't match the Corolla either.

[PJungnitsch]

Good for GM to increase the fuel mileage of the car but this hardly matters (aside from PR) unless they apply this to the automatic transmission Cobalts.

Agree. GM sells very few manual transmission Cobalts and the auto is at the bottom of CR's small car actual fuel mileage results.

When I was looking up SUV mileage the other day I noticed the auto Cobalt got the same overall mpg for CR (23) as the RAV4 SUV.

Great PR though.

[Wolfe]

(2)  "Xylophone" starts with an X.  "Extreme" starts with an E.  When I am appointed Supreme Grand Dictator of North America, anyone who does not strictly adhere to these rules shall be forced to sit in a kindergarten-sized desk twelve hours per day until they admit the error of their ways.

I like your thinking. Once I become Supreme Grand Dictator of the Universe I will delegate responsibility for North America to you so that you can make this so. While you're doing that I would also appreciate it if you would straighten out peoples' confusion about the usage of there, their and they're, not to mention, its and it's. Thanks. 

[Mitlov]

(2)  "Xylophone" starts with an X.  "Extreme" starts with an E.  When I am appointed Supreme Grand Dictator of North America, anyone who does not strictly adhere to these rules shall be forced to sit in a kindergarten-sized desk twelve hours per day until they admit the error of their ways.

I like your thinking. Once I become Supreme Grand Dictator of the Universe I will delegate responsibility for North America to you so that you can make this so. While you're doing that I would also appreciate it if you would straighten out peoples' confusion about the usage of there, their and they're, not to mention, its and it's. Thanks. 

When I am Supreme Grand Dictator of North America, I shall also make one geographical fact mandatory curriculum in all schools:

[Wolfe]

(2)  "Xylophone" starts with an X.  "Extreme" starts with an E.  When I am appointed Supreme Grand Dictator of North America, anyone who does not strictly adhere to these rules shall be forced to sit in a kindergarten-sized desk twelve hours per day until they admit the error of their ways.

I like your thinking. Once I become Supreme Grand Dictator of the Universe I will delegate responsibility for North America to you so that you can make this so. While you're doing that I would also appreciate it if you would straighten out peoples' confusion about the usage of there, their and they're, not to mention, its and it's. Thanks. 

When I am Supreme Grand Dictator of North America, I shall also make one geographical fact mandatory curriculum in all schools:

I should have mentioned that I will reserve the right to overrule you when necessary. Welcome to Canada.

[tpl]

O supreme grand dictators.  Please can we have a rule that every single gallon mentioned on CTC is a real genuine Queen Victoria approved Imperial gallon consisting of 4.4546 genuine Napoleonic litres.

Mitlov O great one we don't actually blame YOU that one of the founders of your country dented the gallon measure while on the Mayflower.

[sirAQUAMAN64]

Good for GM is all I say.  Except crappy tires is a shitty way to do it, I'm sure they aren't the only company that does it.

At least they're competitive when it comes to today's hot topic.

[drederick]

^^^^Give it up already.  All MPG figures on stickers are by the EPA or Ministry.  NOT what the manufacturer says.  And not only that...according to the US EPA, the Cobalt is a SUBCOMPACT and the Corolla a COMPACT.  So Chevy is trying to put one over by comparing Subcompact mileage to some cars on that list that are Compact.

So Chevy's "Best in Class" statement is dubious at best....

This was not a PR statement - it was not released to the general public. As such, this is a classification by GM for GM and may or may not 'jive' with what you want it to. Hopefully that makes sense to you. Now as to why the mini cooper s is listed there and not the lesser mini is beyond me.... but anyways

Now lets take a look at the stats for the Cobalts competitors as listed on the manufacturer's websites:

Year    Make      Engine size   hp   torque   curb weight  transmission    city   hwy    avg combined
2008    cobalt    2.2             148   152        2681           5speed m      24     36           30

2009   corolla        1.8          132   128        2822           5speed m      27     35          31
2008    yaris          1.5          106   103       2293           5speed m      29     35           32
 
2008   civic sedan  1.8           140    128      2628            5speed m     26      34         29
2008   civic sedan  1.8           140    128      2690           5speed auto  25      36         29

2008   fit              1.5           109    105      2432           5speed m      28      34         31

2008 mini clubman   their site is crap                                                 28     37          32 <- premium gas

I would have to say that the package GM offers with this new Cobalt XFE is pretty good considering it has both the largest engine and makes the most power - both HP and Torque.

Just wait until next year when the 2.2 will get VVT and more power AND at better fuel economy.

I suppose I do see where rrocket is coming from not seeming to want to believe this news. The all new 2009 Corolla makes 16 less horsepower, 24 less pound feet of Torque, has a smaller engine by .4 litres, and yet manages to get combined 31mpg versus the Cobalts 30.

Maybe it is because it weighs 2822 pounds? LOL Regardless of what is said the weight of a vehicle has a bigtime factor is real world fuel economy, so it is more than likely easier to get the Cobalt to do the MPG listed than a Corolla.

[Mitlov]

I should have mentioned that I will reserve the right to overrule you when necessary. Welcome to Canada.

 

How did San Francisco end up IN the Christian Republic of Jesusland and southern and eastern Oregon end up OUTSIDE of it?

[jcon]

I thought San Fran was in Mexico?

[Mitlov]

I thought San Fran was in Mexico?

Wow, didn't notice until you mentioned it that all of California is in Mexico.

[mmret]

I thought San Fran was in Mexico?

Wow, didn't notice until you mentioned it that all of California is in Mexico.

You don't even know American geography!

j/k, j/k. I just finished listening to Alan Greenspan's chapter on the American Education system and I couldn't resist.