Author Topic: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs  (Read 33326 times)

Offline safristi

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #40 on: November 25, 2007, 09:28:31 am »
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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #41 on: November 25, 2007, 01:40:11 pm »
If AWD is automatically inferior to RWD for track stuff, and its only advantage is rallying, why do cars such as the Audi R8, Audi RS4, Lamborghini Gallardo Superlegga, Nissan Skyline GT-R, Bugatti Veyron, Porsche 911 Turbo, etc come with AWD?  None of these are rally cars.

There are advantages to RWD on the track, and there are advantages to AWD.  I don't think you can say that one is always better than the other.  I think it's really more of a preference and driving style thing.

In Porsche's case at least, how come all their most track-focused cars are RWD?  GT2, GT3, Carerra GT.  Even the Cayman.  All the cars you've mentioned post rapid lap times due to monsterous power, not remarkable handling.
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Offline safristi

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #42 on: November 25, 2007, 01:56:14 pm »
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« Last Edit: November 25, 2007, 02:02:01 pm by safristi »

Mitlov

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #43 on: November 25, 2007, 03:15:40 pm »
If AWD is automatically inferior to RWD for track stuff, and its only advantage is rallying, why do cars such as the Audi R8, Audi RS4, Lamborghini Gallardo Superlegga, Nissan Skyline GT-R, Bugatti Veyron, Porsche 911 Turbo, etc come with AWD?  None of these are rally cars.

There are advantages to RWD on the track, and there are advantages to AWD.  I don't think you can say that one is always better than the other.  I think it's really more of a preference and driving style thing.

In Porsche's case at least, how come all their most track-focused cars are RWD?  GT2, GT3, Carerra GT.  Even the Cayman.  All the cars you've mentioned post rapid lap times due to monsterous power, not remarkable handling.

That's fine, I'll drop the Porsche and the Bugatti from the list.  That leaves the Audi R8, the Audi RS4, the Nissan Skyline GT-R, and the Lamborghini Gallardo Superlegga.  All of these are meant to be fast around a racetrack, and none are ever meant to go off-road.  These are all cars where, if the manufacturers wanted to, they easily could make them RWD (they have longitudinal crankshafts).  Did Audi do this with the R8 because it wanted the car to be second-best to RWD cars?  How about Nissan with the Skyline GT-R?  Of course not.  They did it because some people prefer AWD over RWD, even in a dedicated performance machine.  Other companies offer RWD instead of AWD because other people prefer RWD over AWD in a dedicated performance machine.

Like I said, it's simply a matter of personal preference, kind of like forced induction versus naturally-aspirated engines.

Offline The Mighty Duck

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #44 on: November 25, 2007, 04:20:48 pm »
:iagree:  Lamborghini considered dropping AWD from the Gallardo Superleggera to save weight, but decided that keeping the AWD system was more important than saving weight.  Says something about the value of AWD, I think.

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #45 on: November 25, 2007, 07:22:15 pm »
:iagree:  Lamborghini considered dropping AWD from the Gallardo Superleggera to save weight, but decided that keeping the AWD system was more important than saving weight.  Says something about the value of AWD, I think.

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Offline DriverJeff

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #46 on: November 26, 2007, 11:39:59 am »
If AWD is automatically inferior to RWD for track stuff, and its only advantage is rallying, why do cars such as the Audi R8, Audi RS4, Lamborghini Gallardo Superlegga, Nissan Skyline GT-R, Bugatti Veyron, Porsche 911 Turbo, etc come with AWD?  None of these are rally cars.

There are advantages to RWD on the track, and there are advantages to AWD.  I don't think you can say that one is always better than the other.  I think it's really more of a preference and driving style thing.

In Porsche's case at least, how come all their most track-focused cars are RWD?  GT2, GT3, Carerra GT.  Even the Cayman.  All the cars you've mentioned post rapid lap times due to monsterous power, not remarkable handling.

That's fine, I'll drop the Porsche and the Bugatti from the list.  That leaves the Audi R8, the Audi RS4, the Nissan Skyline GT-R, and the Lamborghini Gallardo Superlegga.  All of these are meant to be fast around a racetrack, and none are ever meant to go off-road.  These are all cars where, if the manufacturers wanted to, they easily could make them RWD (they have longitudinal crankshafts).  Did Audi do this with the R8 because it wanted the car to be second-best to RWD cars?  How about Nissan with the Skyline GT-R?  Of course not.  They did it because some people prefer AWD over RWD, even in a dedicated performance machine.  Other companies offer RWD instead of AWD because other people prefer RWD over AWD in a dedicated performance machine.

Like I said, it's simply a matter of personal preference, kind of like forced induction versus naturally-aspirated engines.

With the R8, RS4 and even the Lambo, it's all basically the belief of one company that AWD is the best -- Audi.  With Quattro being the halo on which Audi hangs its marketing they couldn't very well produce flagship cars that didn't feature it could they?  Even if the Audi engineers believed they could build a superior car in RWD, I doubt they'd be allowed by the executives to do so. 

Nissan will have produced a phenomenal Grand touring car with every whiz-bang techno item known to automobiledom. 

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #47 on: November 26, 2007, 02:57:57 pm »
Even if you're correct that Audi's AWD heritage forced Lamborghini to use AWD as well, even though the Lambo engineers knew RWD would be better (and I'm not sure I'd agree with that, considering that a RWD Lambo wouldn't hurt Audi's AWD heritage), there's still the Nissan.

Nissan will have produced a phenomenal Grand touring car with every whiz-bang techno item known to automobiledom. 

Why the future tense?  I was talking not just about the new GT-R, but previous Skyline GT-Rs as well.  Nissan has been using AWD in the Skyline GT-R since 1989. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nissan_Skyline_GT-R#3RD_1989.E2.80.931994_.28E-BNR32.29

Furthermore, I was under the impression that previous Skyline GT-Rs have had significant racing heritages.  They're not cushy grand touring cars in the Maserati GranTurismo sense of the word.  Indeed, according to that Wikipedia article, the decision to put AWD into the Skyline GT-R to begin with was to help its performance in Group A racing.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2007, 03:15:53 pm by Mitlov »

Offline Dante

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #49 on: November 28, 2007, 02:30:47 pm »
Interesting read:

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/sedans/112_0801_mitsubishi_lancer_evolution_comparison

"You can hop in the X and go fast right away-it's much more forgiving and easier to push than the IX."

I've read similar comments in Car & Driver and Automobile.  While the EVO X is heavier, the components that add weight serve a real purpose, and not just safety and comfort.  It's got a better chassis.

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #50 on: December 27, 2007, 02:42:33 am »
Evo X vs STI US-specs "war". Note that the MT tested the lower Evo trim, the GSR. I cannot wait to see if the MR would be even better as it has some mods and of course the new SST tranny.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/sedans/112_0803_subaru_wrx_sti_vs_mitsubishi_evolution_x/index.html

Offline TopGun

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #51 on: December 27, 2007, 11:47:46 am »
I stopped by the Mitsu dealer in Burlington to pick up some info.  The guy I spoke with said they are getting one in the showroom in January.  He gave me a very confusing process if you actually wanted to drive the car.

I think it's a shame the manual transmission is not available with the higher end model.  Ya...I know it performs better...but I don't care...I just like the feel of it...and the challenge of having to be good at something to enjoy it.

Offline initial_D

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #52 on: December 27, 2007, 11:51:40 am »
Canadian pricing out yet?

Mitlov

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #53 on: December 27, 2007, 12:13:40 pm »
Evo X vs STI US-specs "war". Note that the MT tested the lower Evo trim, the GSR. I cannot wait to see if the MR would be even better as it has some mods and of course the new SST tranny.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/sedans/112_0803_subaru_wrx_sti_vs_mitsubishi_evolution_x/index.html

Excellent write-up.  Thanks for posting that.

Quote
Maybe, says one of the ringside judges, senior editor Ron Kiino. "The Evo handles much sharper than the STI, with crisper turn-in and better steering feel throughout the range. The Evo also allows for more rotation, which lets you to attack corners harder. AYC takes some getting used to, but once you trust the sensations it creates (oversteer), it becomes fun and addictive."

In comparison, the STI feels like a blunt instrument-more ground and pound to the Evo's slice and dice. Continues Kiino, "The STI's steering offers decent feel, but it's less organic than the Evo's. It also exhibits more understeer, as if it's protecting you out there and won't let you seriously screw up."

I'd gladly give up the STi's superior power-to-weight ratio for the EVO's razor-sharp handling. 

As for the EVO MR's transmission, I won't judge these dual-clutch automated manuals until I've experienced one first-hand.  They're catching on like wildfire with very performance-oriented cars (R32, GT-R, and now EVO MR), so there might be something to them.

Offline TopGun

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #54 on: December 27, 2007, 09:39:55 pm »
...dual-clutch automated...They're catching on like wildfire with very performance-oriented cars (R32, GT-R, and now EVO MR), so there might be something to them.

I don't doubt there's something to them - higher performance.  The shifts they can make are way faster than a human can accomplish...and there's virtually no interruption of power on the upshift...and perfect rev matching on the downshift...along with a cool sounding throttle blip.

I don't like them because it allows cars that we auto enthusiasts think are special to be accessable to people that think of cars as appliances.

(Insert old guy voice here) It used to be that performance cars were, generally, cars that the "normal" person wouldn't bother with...they couldn't identify the benefit that came with the grief.

Applying it back to the Evo X...people that couldn't be bothered to learn how to drive a manual transmission because it interferes with their lattes and cell phones are now part of the Evo's target market.  Mainstreaming may be good marketing...and very good business...but that doesn't mean I have to like it!

Offline mmret

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #55 on: December 27, 2007, 09:48:30 pm »
Applying it back to the Evo X...people that couldn't be bothered to learn how to drive a manual transmission because it interferes with their lattes and cell phones are now part of the Evo's target market.

No, those people drive M3s and C63 AMGs.
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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #56 on: December 28, 2007, 12:12:26 am »
Applying it back to the Evo X...people that couldn't be bothered to learn how to drive a manual transmission because it interferes with their lattes and cell phones are now part of the Evo's target market.  Mainstreaming may be good marketing...and very good business...but that doesn't mean I have to like it!

Right.  Because everyone who finds appeal in a dual-clutch automated manual is lazy  ::)

Offline TopGun

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #57 on: December 28, 2007, 09:16:22 am »
Right.  Because everyone who finds appeal in a dual-clutch automated manual is lazy  ::)

Lazy?  Yes...absolutely...positively!!!   ;D   I admit to having an interest in these transmissions too...I just can't convince myself to get one...perhaps some day.

Of course I'm not saying they're lazy people...I'm saying it gives people the option to be lazy about not wanting to learn how to drive a manual  OR put up with the sometimes pain of driving a manual...which, I, personally, have associated with a "true" enthusiast car. 

Heck, I'm lazy and use a GPS when I fly instead of reading a map.  Does that make less of an airplane enthusiast?  It might!

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #58 on: December 28, 2007, 11:11:50 am »
...
I don't like them because it allows cars that we auto enthusiasts think are special to be accessable to people that think of cars as appliances.

(Insert old guy voice here) It used to be that performance cars were, generally, cars that the "normal" person wouldn't bother with...they couldn't identify the benefit that came with the grief.
...
Mainstreaming may be good marketing...and very good business...but that doesn't mean I have to like it!

I agree completely with your elitist curmudgeon sentiment.   

;D

Offline initial_D

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Re: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs
« Reply #59 on: December 28, 2007, 11:46:05 am »
Don't care what other people buys them, ... I want ONE still.  :)