Topic: 2008 Mitsubishi EVO X Canadian Specs

[johngenx]

Indy and F1 have both either fielded AWD cars or lobbied for AWD.  Banned in both cases.

[B2]

AWD in the case for EVO and STi allows for maximum power delivery all the time not just at standing launch.

Yes, but at the cost of extra weight, which in turn reduces every other performance factor of the car.  Also, I wouldn't say maximum power delivery.  There is more power loss with any extra mechanical linkage (like AWD).  We will see how much HP the EVO X is putting out at the wheels when someone dyno's it.

Like I said, these cars are rally bred, so the weight of AWD vs. the benefit is worthwhile.  On the track?  I dunno...  I'm not discounting AWD at all, and it's uses in the real world are a great advantage, which is where these cars are realistically driven most of the time.  I wonder how much cost AWD adds to the EVO X.  Could they sell a FWD version for $5000 less?  Or could they make it RWD only?

Indy and F1 have both either fielded AWD cars or lobbied for AWD.  Banned in both cases.

Happen to know why this was banned?

[ghost]

Yes. At some touring car races, awd cars are not allowed due to unfair advantage. Do a search on AWD Unfair Advantage and you will come across old articles on Quattros being banned.
You are correct that AWD cars are heavier than non-AWD cars. However like the STi's case it is no heavier than a 2wd and in some cases even lighter! It's all about intelligent packaging. The weight penalty may not necessarily negate all of the AWD's performance.

If you watch one of the Speed Challenges race the Audi A4s are very competitive with the 3-series, TSX etc. And when it rains, the A4s disappears ahead of the pack. It's one of the few events where they mix up the drivetrain approaches.

You cannot compare a 4-wheel dyno with that of a 2-wheel dyno. They measure power delivery differently.  Much like there are differences b/t say a dynojet vs a mustang vs dyno dynamics etc. You are discounting the fact that all four wheels are providing forward thrust while with a typical FWD, the rear wheels are there to just provide support so that the trunk will not drag on the ground. 

[HeliDriver]

If you watch one of the Speed Challenges race the Audi A4s are very competitive with the 3-series, TSX etc. And when it rains, the A4s disappears ahead of the pack. It's one of the few events where they mix up the drivetrain approaches.

Don't they monkey with those cars to keep the racing competetive? Say, if a car is too fast, then they'll add weight to penalize it for the next race. If a car gets handed its lunch one week, the rules say it can come back lighter next week, or maybe run a less restrictive baffle in the intake.

Kind of hard to draw any conclusions about differing cars/drivetrains when the playing field is artificially levelled like that.

[B2]

You are correct that AWD cars are heavier than non-AWD cars. However like the STi's case it is no heavier than a 2wd and in some cases even lighter! It's all about intelligent packaging. The weight penalty may not necessarily negate all of the AWD's performance.

The STi may be lighter than some other 2wd vehicles, but there are far too many factors to consider such as dimensions of vehicle, structural rigidity, noise suppression, etc...  The STi might be lighter than a 2wd BMW, but the BMW is probably quieter inside, provides more room for passengers, etc...

Using the same exact car, like an EVO X for example, and removing the AWD components and anything else required to make the car AWD (like strengthening the chassis connection points) could probably save 300 lbs of weight.  That's a lot of weight.  I would bet the car would see better lap times overall with that weight gone.

I do understand that AWD is the essence of these cars and they don't want to change that, which is fine.

[Snowman]

The inherent advantages of AWD are realised on real world driving conditions found on public streets and highways, not on pristine track conditions.

[Mitlov]

Like I said, these cars are rally bred, so the weight of AWD vs. the benefit is worthwhile.  On the track?  I dunno...  I'm not discounting AWD at all, and it's uses in the real world are a great advantage, which is where these cars are realistically driven most of the time.  I wonder how much cost AWD adds to the EVO X.

If AWD is automatically inferior to RWD for track stuff, and its only advantage is rallying, why do cars such as the Audi R8, Audi RS4, Lamborghini Gallardo Superlegga, Nissan Skyline GT-R, Bugatti Veyron, Porsche 911 Turbo, etc come with AWD?  None of these are rally cars.

There are advantages to RWD on the track, and there are advantages to AWD.  I don't think you can say that one is always better than the other.  I think it's really more of a preference and driving style thing.

[JSCC]

I noticed the weight too, Ghost.  What was the weight on that 'fat pig' 135i again? 

No heated seats?  No steering wheel controls?  It had better be fun to drive!

Heated seats in the MR  and the diff has a steering wheel control. 

I have a little spreadsheet on a bunch of cars, and the power to weight on for the EVO is bested by two cars (I care about on my spreadsheet) - the 135i and ... the MazdaSpeed3.  Now, getting those cars to hook up is a whole 'nother matter.

What's also interesting is how tiny the trunk appears to be.  6.9 cubic feet!  A Mini is 5.7, an RX-8 is 7.6 and my e36 BMW was 10.3.  My Miata was 3.6 cu.ft.!!
......

There is some sort of box in the trunk under the lining.
Either the battery or some sort of electonic device.

Whatever that thing is, it takes away a huge amount of space.

[Mitlov]

The EVO is absolutely loaded with electronics--electronics that allow it to go as fast around Top Gear's test track as a Lamborghini Gallardo.  They've got to go somewhere, and the trunk is as good a place as any.

The comparisons in cargo capacity with Miatas and RX-8s isn't comparing apples to apples, because the EVO has a spacious back seat, which can be used for cargo if you're not carrying five people.  And who buys an EVO to carry five people and their golf bags?

[vz64]

...
If AWD is automatically inferior to RWD for track stuff, and its only advantage is rallying, why do cars such as the Audi R8, Audi RS4, Lamborghini Gallardo Superlegga, Nissan Skyline GT-R, Bugatti Veyron, Porsche 911 Turbo, etc come with AWD?  None of these are rally cars.

There are advantages to RWD on the track, and there are advantages to AWD.  I don't think you can say that one is always better than the other.  I think it's really more of a preference and driving style thing.

Well said Mitlov. Notice that it is not a simple distribution of power to all 4 corners, but also capacity to fine-tune the distribution of power front-back (ACD) and side-to-side (AYC). Without its sophisticated AWD system EVO wouldn't be EVO... it would be lancer with extra ponies.

[initial_D]

Interested to see the MSRP for the EVO X.

The old stock EVO VIII & IV have similar numbers on a track as those of exotic cars, the new EVO is promised to be easier to drive and faster on the track.

[supercrip]

I guess these probably came from the same folks that posted these http://forums.evolutionm.net/showthread.php?t=304898 and this http://toronto-subaru-club.com/forums/showpost.php?p=884182&postcount=79 where the poster was saying that he was told that the pricing he was told by Mitsu folks would probably be $45k for the GSR, $50k for the MR, and $55k for the MR Premium. A bit steep and since the SST Tranny looks like it'll be delayed caused me to go back to the dealer I had left a 2k deposit with for an Evo and canceled the deal.

Now, looks like the Sti got somewhat of a lackluster launch in LA see http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=QkwNpJ3LZhE&eurl=http://thehollywoodextra.blogspot.com/

Now a question for Snowy. Ever been to Temiscaming or Kipawa Lake I hear the fishing is pretty good there?

[tpl]

Like I said, these cars are rally bred, so the weight of AWD vs. the benefit is worthwhile.  On the track?  I dunno...  I'm not discounting AWD at all, and it's uses in the real world are a great advantage, which is where these cars are realistically driven most of the time.  I wonder how much cost AWD adds to the EVO X.

If AWD is automatically inferior to RWD for track stuff, and its only advantage is rallying, why do cars such as the Audi R8, Audi RS4, Lamborghini Gallardo Superlegga, Nissan Skyline GT-R, Bugatti Veyron, Porsche 911 Turbo, etc come with AWD?  None of these are rally cars.

My answer is tire technology first and second to make those very powerful  cars a bit more user friendly ( aka able to be driven by people who can afford them as distinct by people who know how to drive race cars)  under normally found weather conditions.

[safristi]

  are U implying us Canucks aren't as good PILOTS as the FINNS.......the Mickey Finns....

 Yup there will be some rich parents lamenting Jr's YUMP into some farmers field and blaming Subaru & Toyo....... .."we shoulda got him a nice Z06 or Lexus F fer High SKOOL Graduation......................"

[Dante]

IIRC the battery and the washer fluid have been relocated to the trunk for better weight distribution hence smaller cargo capacity.

[safristi]

..washer fluid in trunk.....better BUY the -50C degree stuff then...tha's a first..why NOT PUT the ENGINE THERE...!!!!    Porchabishi........i sees ya.....

[robarakira]

dealer here is taking orders.

I think I'll wait till the hatch comes 

[Iso Octane]

The inherent advantages of AWD are realised on real world driving conditions found on public streets and highways, not on pristine track conditions.

Sure it is.  I'd say it shows more benefits on the track.  For track day hobbyists with not-quite-professional driving abilities, not having to worry about throttle oversteer and spinning yourself off the track is a big deal.

What's the worst that can happen on the street without AWD?  You'll spin a single wheel for a breif moment and lose to the Honda Odyssey?

[The Mighty Duck]

What's the worst that can happen on the street without AWD?  You'll spin a single wheel for a breif moment and lose to the Honda Odyssey?

  AWD has numerous safety advantages, especially when driving in rain or snow.

[Snowman]

I guess these probably came from the same folks that posted these http://forums.evolutionm.net/showthread.php?t=304898 and this http://toronto-subaru-club.com/forums/showpost.php?p=884182&postcount=79 where the poster was saying that he was told that the pricing he was told by Mitsu folks would probably be $45k for the GSR, $50k for the MR, and $55k for the MR Premium. A bit steep and since the SST Tranny looks like it'll be delayed caused me to go back to the dealer I had left a 2k deposit with for an Evo and canceled the deal.

Now, looks like the Sti got somewhat of a lackluster launch in LA see http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=QkwNpJ3LZhE&eurl=http://thehollywoodextra.blogspot.com/

Now a question for Snowy. Ever been to Temiscaming or Kipawa Lake I hear the fishing is pretty good there?

Yes, a friend has a cottage on the Ontario side at the mouth of the Matabitchuan River. The fishing was good but too many tourists for my liking.