Topic: 2008 Subaru Impreza prices

[sirAQUAMAN64]

It's just simple. It's an extra step to driving, not all of us are enthusiasts, and really nowadays there's no NEED to drive manual. The option costs more for the 'luxury', but most modern autos don't consume substantially more fuel - sometimes less, they're for the most part responsive - sometimes moreso, and it's not unsafe or lazy. It's more comfortable if anything. And after a long day or on a long trip, comfort is valuable. And technically, the auto is more advanced - times have changed.

I agree about the no-need-to factor, and it's the no-need-to drive manuals that makes us worse drivers overall.  The same way as we don't need to grow our food anymore and as a result we've become worse farmers overall.  It would be silly for most of us city dwellers to argue that we're just as good at farming as our rural ancestors from the past.

No, I wouldn't say I'm good at farming because I'm not farming at all.

In this case, you're still driving. Only advancements mean you can drive without shifting forward gears yourself. Your arguement there is more akin to telling a farmer today he's not as good because he's using a tractor instead of knowing how to train and labour using horse/mule.

[dorin]

I guarantee that I can drive my automatic car better than 50% of the people that drive manual cars.

You're probably quite right.  However, my point is that having the additional skill of driving manual makes you a better driver (as in better than if you don't know how to drive manual).  Furthermore, knowing how to drive manual gives you a feel and understanding for how the engine transfers power to the road that you can never quite get if you have only ever driven automatics.

Seriously, just because a person can drive a manual transmission it does not automatically (pun intended) make the a better driver.

I respectfully disagree.  I also believe that motorcycle drivers learn skills that car drivers don't and some of those skills are transferable and make them better car drivers.

In an emergency situation where the driver has to go from 100kmh down to 20kms shift into a lower gear, hard on the gas and throw in an emergency lane maneuver then accelerates.....there are a lot of manual driver that couldn't do that. 

I don't get the point of the example...  Even if a lot of manual drivers might not be able to do that quickly/smoothly enough in a manual car, but all manual drivers could do it in an automatic car.  All automatic-only drivers would be unable to do it in a manual car. 

[dorin]

What have I described about my wife that says that she is lazy or a whiner?

Good reason - she doesn't enjoy it. What more reason do you need?

It depends on whether your wife knows how to drive manual or not.  If she doesn't know and she doesn't want to learn then she's lazy and/or a whiner (sadly, that's my partner - I absolutely love her but she is a whiner when it comes to driving and the whininenss makes her not do it, hence lazy).  Is she does know how to drive a manual and she's just "not enjoying it" then she's just plain whiny.  "I'm not enjoying it" is not a good reason for not driving manual in my books.

I know a lot of poor drivers with manuals so your argument holds no weight.

-poor manual drivers are definitely out there.  They would be even -poorer drivers if they only knew how to drive automatics.

[safristi]

  Munuel..MANUAL!!!...Manuel!!!...we will need to ask him.....after he sorts out Big Thumb & Bridges tete a tete......


 GEARSHIFTS @ NOON....Ten Paces ........FIRE AWAY.......

[tpl]

"I also believe that motorcycle drivers learn skills that car drivers don't and some of those skills are transferable and make them better car drivers.
"

Now I DO agree with that... as someone who has not been anywhere near a motorcycle for 45 years and hated it when I had one.

Unfortunately, motorcyclists in Ontario ( the ones I see on the highways) may be good at controlling their machines but seem to have no idea how to be safe on a motorcycle.  It appears that they are all taught, like car drivers I suppose, that the brakes are the thing you use to get out of trouble rather than the throttle. I prefer the french style of motorcycle riding, faster than the traffic, splitting lanes, keeping way ahead of the cars and trucks.
Not to mention riding in a tee shirt and sneakers... I guess they only do that until the first time they put the bike down

[jcon]

It depends on whether your wife knows how to drive manual or not.  If she doesn't know and she doesn't want to learn then she's lazy and/or a whiner (sadly, that's my partner - I absolutely love her but she is a whiner when it comes to driving and the whininenss makes her not do it, hence lazy).  Is she does know how to drive a manual and she's just "not enjoying it" then she's just plain whiny.  "I'm not enjoying it" is not a good reason for not driving manual in my books.

Don't push your resentment of your partner on to me. If you think your partner is a lazy whiner, fine, but your comments are unfounded and pathetic. You know nothing about my wife. Calling her a whiner because you have some sort superiority complex is sad. Your comments are out of line.

[2JDM]

Easy people. 

[random006]

I don't get the point of the example...  Even if a lot of manual drivers might not be able to do that quickly/smoothly enough in a manual car, but all manual drivers could do it in an automatic car.  All automatic-only drivers would be unable to do it in a manual car. 

Incorrect.  I am an "auto-only" driver but have driven the occasional manual.  I can up-shift and down-shift quite easily, all the while adapting to the rhythm of the clutch.  My only problem?  The typical "newbie" one of stalling out of neutral when going into first or reverse.

I know I could learn the skill but so far have yet to see the need.  With auto transmissions becoming more efficient and more responsive all the time, the argument seems to me quite moot.  It has become simply one of personal choice.

As for the rest of your points on this thread, I only have this to say:

Pompous, Arrogant, Dogmatic
Irrelevant, Immaterial and quite frankly ought to be Inadmissible.   

[Snowman]

Children    I’m glad I leased my 2006. I imagine a few people who bought will be upset with impact of the new pricing on their residuals.

[wing]

Thanks to Sand Man for bringing this back on topic.

Please take your manual / automatic argument offline, it's getting a little too heated.

[jcon]

Wing - Any chance of you getting your hands on the WRX-hatch in the near future?

[wing]

September 4th I get the WRX  Not sure if it is the hatch or sedan though.

[Dante]

Wow ... based on Dorin's assertion, I should consider myself a better driver than the majority just because I know how to drive a manual.  
Is it driving a manual more rewarding for those who enjoy driving? YES, it is.
Like others said, did it ever occur to you to consider that there is more to make a driver better than another apart from knowing how to shift gears? Keep in mind that this comes for one who knows how to drive manual and who did it for longer than driving automatic. With all due respect, I do too find your assessment self-centered and arrogant.
If you are working on your Ph D, as you felt necessary to mention, I hope you don’t do it just because it makes you feel superior to those without it. I know quite a few super-smart people in Computer Science, which it happens to be my field as well, that don’t hold any other designation more than a University degree. Are they inferior to those holding a PhD? The straight answer is NO.
Please understand I used this example as an illustration to make my point not to underestimate your professional accomplishments (which I happen to value).

[DriverJeff]

September 4th I get the WRX  Not sure if it is the hatch or sedan though.

Nerts!  Right AFTER the labour day weekend when I'd be near-enough to come and have a close look at it.   

[captain_ron]

Personally, I own 3 manuals in my garage, and have never owned an automatic.  I still think automatics are safer, you can keep 2 hands on the steering wheel at all times and focus your attention rather than shifting.  Would anyone here want some 75 year old plus old lady driving a manual or automatic?? I'll take automatic rather than her rolling back down a hill my damaging my NSX sitting behind her. 

[mdxtasy]

What have I described about my wife that says that she is lazy or a whiner?

Good reason - she doesn't enjoy it. What more reason do you need?

It depends on whether your wife knows how to drive manual or not.  If she doesn't know and she doesn't want to learn then she's lazy and/or a whiner (sadly, that's my partner - I absolutely love her but she is a whiner when it comes to driving and the whininenss makes her not do it, hence lazy).  Is she does know how to drive a manual and she's just "not enjoying it" then she's just plain whiny.  "I'm not enjoying it" is not a good reason for not driving manual in my books.

dorin....do you know how to basket weave?  No?  LAZY! 

If a person has no interest in learning....that doesn't make him/her lazy.  You learn about things that interest you. 

[Mitlov]

Personally, I own 3 manuals in my garage, and have never owned an automatic.  I still think automatics are safer, you can keep 2 hands on the steering wheel at all times and focus your attention rather than shifting.  Would anyone here want some 75 year old plus old lady driving a manual or automatic?? I'll take automatic rather than her rolling back down a hill my damaging my NSX sitting behind her. 

On the other hand, people don't run over and kill anyone if they confuse brakes for gas in a manual transmission car.  At worst, they redline their own engine by stepping on the clutch and gas simultaneously.  I remember an incident a few years back where an elderly man confused the gas for the brake pedal, and plowed his car through a crowded street festival, killing something like 10 people.  I may have missed the details, but more or less that's what happened.  I can't find the link now, but here's a story where a toddler and a teenager were run over in a similar incident.

http://www.concordmonitor.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070708/REPOSITORY/707080396/0/FRONTPAGE

[Triple Bob]

This thread has gotten ridiculous, and Dorin lay off jcon's wife FFS, just 'cos she doesn't want to drive manual, who are you to criticise?

 

[dorin]

Please take your manual / automatic argument offline, it's getting a little too heated.

In deference to the guy in charge I'm dropping my side of the argument in this thread.  PM me or start a new thread if you want me to keep going.

[mdxtasy]

This thread has gotten ridiculous, and Dorin lay off jcon's wife FFS, just 'cos she doesn't want to drive manual, who are you to criticise?