Author Topic: Advice on buying a leased vehicle  (Read 3733 times)

Barryk

  • Guest
Advice on buying a leased vehicle
« on: January 30, 2005, 07:59:28 pm »
Looking for some help in the process to buy a private vehicle when the owner still has a lease on it.  Do you give the person a check and go with them to the dealership where the lease is and witness them pay it off or do you put a clause in the Bill of Sale saying that the lean will be removed within a certain time period.  Would there be a problem registering it (Alberta) if the dealership still has the rights or lean on the vehicle.  Thanks for any help.

Sterling

  • Guest
Advice on buying a leased vehicle
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2005, 08:54:12 pm »
Make the cheque out to both the guy and the leasing company. Then accompany the guy to pay the lease off. If your cheque is more than the lease payoff, the dealership (or lease company) will just cut him back the difference. If your cheque is for less than the payout, then take back your cheque until the guy pays the difference. Get a photocopy of the bill of sale or receipt showing the lease has been paid out. Technically, what is happening is that the guy is buying the car from the leasing company and then you are buying it from the guy. As such you will draw up a bill of sale showing that the guy has sold it to you.

(Message edited by Sterling on January 30, 2005)

Offline johngenx

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 33318
  • Carma: +758/-938
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2009 Toyota Corolla, 2004 Toyota Highlander V-6 4WD, 2001 Subaru Forester, 1994 Mazda Miata
Advice on buying a leased vehicle
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2005, 08:54:45 pm »
Dealerships don't have leases.  Nothing to do with it.  There is some financing company that owns the leased car, not the dealership.  You'll need to speak to the leasing company and find out how to go about taking ownership of the vehicle.  You see, the person driving it DOES NOT own it, and technically, may not sell it to you.  The leasing company owns it, and only they can arrange for you to take ownership.  If you only have a bill of sale from the "driver" (the person "selling" the car) you might be a little surprised to find the leasing company coming to find it's car.

BTW, it's lien, not lean.  A person leans on the wall, you place a lien on a car.

Sterling

  • Guest
Advice on buying a leased vehicle
« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2005, 08:57:44 pm »
Just FYI, dealerships CAN have leases that they finance themselves. Typically, leases will be done through a finance company like GMAC or Ford Credit but larger dealerships do write their own leases.

Offline johngenx

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 33318
  • Carma: +758/-938
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2009 Toyota Corolla, 2004 Toyota Highlander V-6 4WD, 2001 Subaru Forester, 1994 Mazda Miata
Advice on buying a leased vehicle
« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2005, 09:10:54 pm »
I haven't seen many dealerships doing that.  Credit risk is not their business.  They sell the financing off to whomever, depending on the customer.  Some dealerships offering "in-house" financing work with consumer finance compaines like Household Finance and others that actually carry the paper.  I haven't heard of a dealer using their own money to finance leases or purchases for retail customers.

Offline ovr50

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 18453
  • Carma: +27/-126
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Advice on buying a leased vehicle
« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2005, 09:16:31 pm »
My local Toyota dealer does some of their own money-leasing, but not the majority - that is done thu Toyota Canada. When I had the '02 Impreza, the lease was with Kelowna Toyota solely; so it is done, but not extensively.
2022 Mazda CX-5 Signature Turbo in Snowflake White Pearl
and
2012 Toyota Camry SE V6 in Alpine White

Sterling

  • Guest
Advice on buying a leased vehicle
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2005, 09:17:16 pm »
Just because you've never heard of it ...

I can assure you that major dealerships, mainly domestics, carry their own paper. For example, when say, Ford Credit, offers a lease rate in the mid teens (as they do on Econoline vans and on used cars) it isn't that difficult for a dealership to carry the paper at a better rate on an in-house lease.

(Message edited by Sterling on January 30, 2005)

Offline johngenx

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 33318
  • Carma: +758/-938
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2009 Toyota Corolla, 2004 Toyota Highlander V-6 4WD, 2001 Subaru Forester, 1994 Mazda Miata
Advice on buying a leased vehicle
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2005, 09:34:25 pm »
Well, suppose it does happen.  It's rare, and the advice to "pay the dealership" is probably erroneous.  The course of action is to find out who carries the lease and make arrangements with them for their customer to early terminate and you buy the car.

It amazes me that a dealership would carry consumer debt.  Diversification of risk would be difficult unless you could write hundreds, maybe thousands of leases.  With customers paying cash, leasing with the captive arm, using bank financing and other methods, it seems that it would be difficult to diversify away the risk associated with the loan portfolio.

I know that the variance of non-payment with respect to used cars, and cars in general tends to be higher than mortgages, but lower than comsumer debt for items like electronics.  When I was in banking, we charged higher rates for used cars not only because of the lower security on the loan, but also due to larger amounts of variance (aka risk) in the performance of the loans in general.

Interesting.  I suppose if you could beat the crap out of the consumer at the point of purchase (jacking the price) you could mitigate some of the exposure due to depreciation of the asset, typically faster than the payments on the principle portion of the loan.

If you had enough dealerships under ownership, you  might be able to diversify the portfolio enough by pooling the paper over a number of dealers located in different geographic areas.  Someone like Jimmy Pattison might be able to do it.

Sterling

  • Guest
Advice on buying a leased vehicle
« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2005, 01:25:24 am »
Even if the lease is through a finance arm, paying the dealership is sometimes exactly what happens. For instance, if the lease is through Ford Credit, the cheque to pay out that lease is made out to the dealership. If a customer was to mail in a cheque payable to Ford Credit, Ford Credit would sign the cheque and send it back to the dealership for deposit. The dealership would then send a cheque back to Ford Credit for payment. That's just way it works, with Ford Credit at least.

Offline sparky

  • Auto Obsessed
  • ***
  • Posts: 662
  • Carma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Advice on buying a leased vehicle
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2005, 01:00:54 pm »
Dealers often act as agents for the leasing co. I've returned all my leased vehicles to the dealers who sold them. They do the final inspection and take care of getting any deposit returned or any added fees collected.

Offline tpl

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 23909
  • Carma: +298/-675
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2022 Taos
Advice on buying a leased vehicle
« Reply #10 on: February 04, 2005, 06:53:35 am »
"Technically, what is happening is that the guy is buying the car from the leasing company and then you are buying it from the guy. As such you will draw up a bill of sale showing that the guy has sold it to you. "

I was told that the transaction described above is a sure way to pay PST twice in Ont.

The right way is for the lessee to hand the car back to the lessor ( which generally will be at the dealer) having previously arranged for the dealer to immediately sell the car at the buyback price plus taxes to the new owner.

If the lessee "buys" the car they will have to pay PST on the price and then the new owner will have to pay it as well when they buy it from the new owner.  I am pretty sure that if the car is just handed back to the leasing Co that the PST on the value is in limbo somehow.

Maybe wrong but this is what I was told at an Audi dealer when I had a friend who was interested in buying my A4 straight off lease.  

Theoretically the dealer may lose money  as they could probably sell the car at a profit but against that they don't have yet another 2nd hand car on the books.
The most radical revolutionary will become a conservative the day after the revolution.

Sterling

  • Guest
Advice on buying a leased vehicle
« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2005, 12:59:18 pm »
Yes, that advice was based on experience in Alberta where PST is a non-issue.

If the car is leased through a company like Toyota credit, GMAC, Ford Credit, etc. and the car is returned, it is not on the dealership's books at all. They don't own it, the leasing company does.