Topic: The car market is turning.

[OliverD]

Noticing some big price reductions on used cars. For the first time since 2020 I'm seeing cars and thinking the asking prices are fairly reasonable.

Or perhaps you've just gotten used to the high prices?

Nah, I'm talking about dealers cutting prices on in stock cars by $4-8k. And this is cars that were priced in the $25-35k range to begin with.

[ArticSteve]

This guy seems to think it's slowing down...

https://youtu.be/haGE79-a1sw?si=wXSsplfrfyGX9x39



Sent from my SM-S901W using Tapatalk

Watched him before.  I thinks he makes more from youtube than selling cars.  Does a lot of click bait.

AS for the Canadian used market?  It all comes down to supply and demand.  The problem Canadian used vehicle buyers have that are looking for off lease and 2-4 year old trade ins is the US.  A lot of Canadian product gets absorbed down
there.  While the beaters stay here.  It's nasty.  Used car loans are at 9% for people with good credit scores and the vehicle not being over 5 years.

[warp]

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/costofliving/financing-car-dealerships-cash-1.7034159

Some dealerships in Canada just don't want your cash when you're trying to buy a car.

Tammy Hussey discovered that when she took her 84-year-old father car shopping this summer. After test-driving a 2021 Jeep Compass at a Toronto dealership, John Hussey had the money in his bank account to buy it outright — but his daughter says he was told he could only drive it home if he financed it.

After spending 30 minutes trying to convince the salesperson to let her dad use his savings to buy the car, Hussey said he "abruptly" told them to "please leave."

"Everybody jokes about the used car salesman — they're known to chase deals and move product. So to be told to leave a dealership when you basically are ready to write a cheque for the car? I still can't get over it."

North York Chrysler did not respond to an interview request. However, according to its website, "to prevent exports and non-retail purchases, cash sales are restricted to local customers residing within eight [kilometres] of the dealership."

[marcus_go]

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/costofliving/financing-car-dealerships-cash-1.7034159

Some dealerships in Canada just don't want your cash when you're trying to buy a car.

Tammy Hussey discovered that when she took her 84-year-old father car shopping this summer. After test-driving a 2021 Jeep Compass at a Toronto dealership, John Hussey had the money in his bank account to buy it outright — but his daughter says he was told he could only drive it home if he financed it.

After spending 30 minutes trying to convince the salesperson to let her dad use his savings to buy the car, Hussey said he "abruptly" told them to "please leave."

"Everybody jokes about the used car salesman — they're known to chase deals and move product. So to be told to leave a dealership when you basically are ready to write a cheque for the car? I still can't get over it."

North York Chrysler did not respond to an interview request. However, according to its website, "to prevent exports and non-retail purchases, cash sales are restricted to local customers residing within eight [kilometres] of the dealership."

The best part of that story is that he ended up with a RAV4 and not a Compass...

[PJungnitsch]

Same thing happened to my stepdaughter, except with a new CX-5. Couldn't even test drive it.

She bought the Corolla Cross instead the next day

[rrocket]

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/costofliving/financing-car-dealerships-cash-1.7034159

Some dealerships in Canada just don't want your cash when you're trying to buy a car.

Tammy Hussey discovered that when she took her 84-year-old father car shopping this summer. After test-driving a 2021 Jeep Compass at a Toronto dealership, John Hussey had the money in his bank account to buy it outright — but his daughter says he was told he could only drive it home if he financed it.

After spending 30 minutes trying to convince the salesperson to let her dad use his savings to buy the car, Hussey said he "abruptly" told them to "please leave."

"Everybody jokes about the used car salesman — they're known to chase deals and move product. So to be told to leave a dealership when you basically are ready to write a cheque for the car? I still can't get over it."

North York Chrysler did not respond to an interview request. However, according to its website, "to prevent exports and non-retail purchases, cash sales are restricted to local customers residing within eight [kilometres] of the dealership."

I actually ran into something similar not long ago when helping someone find a vehicle....the low price that was advertised was for "financing" only. The cash price was a few thousand more.

I suppose there's nothing stopping you from financing it then paying it off completely 48 hours later?? Unless it's not an open loan or some crazy fine print?

[rrocket]

This guy seems to think it's slowing down...

I'm starting to see it. There's certain cars I look at week in, week out. And the prices are starting to drop.

This weekend I even (shockingly) got a text message from a guy who pulled the rug out from under me for a high mileage 996 TT I tried to buy before Covid. I did all of my due diligence. And when it came time to pay, he jacked the price on me by $15k because he saw others asking big money.

Turns out he couldn't sell it for the big money (as much as low mileage 996 TT) and he still has it! He offered it to me again...but still $8k more than we originally agreed on.

I'll keep waiting....

[ArticSteve]

Ya, used car prices are subject to the owner's or dealer's deteriorating balance sheet.  New vehicles are still subject to inflation.  Manufacturers rebates will still exist, but the MSRPs will never reverse.

[draghon]

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/costofliving/financing-car-dealerships-cash-1.7034159

Some dealerships in Canada just don't want your cash when you're trying to buy a car.

Tammy Hussey discovered that when she took her 84-year-old father car shopping this summer. After test-driving a 2021 Jeep Compass at a Toronto dealership, John Hussey had the money in his bank account to buy it outright — but his daughter says he was told he could only drive it home if he financed it.

After spending 30 minutes trying to convince the salesperson to let her dad use his savings to buy the car, Hussey said he "abruptly" told them to "please leave."

"Everybody jokes about the used car salesman — they're known to chase deals and move product. So to be told to leave a dealership when you basically are ready to write a cheque for the car? I still can't get over it."

North York Chrysler did not respond to an interview request. However, according to its website, "to prevent exports and non-retail purchases, cash sales are restricted to local customers residing within eight [kilometres] of the dealership."

The best part of that story is that he ended up with a RAV4 and not a Compass...

My thoughts exactly. Salesman did him a solid by not letting him buy a Compass

[WP v3.32]

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/costofliving/financing-car-dealerships-cash-1.7034159

Some dealerships in Canada just don't want your cash when you're trying to buy a car.

Tammy Hussey discovered that when she took her 84-year-old father car shopping this summer. After test-driving a 2021 Jeep Compass at a Toronto dealership, John Hussey had the money in his bank account to buy it outright — but his daughter says he was told he could only drive it home if he financed it.

After spending 30 minutes trying to convince the salesperson to let her dad use his savings to buy the car, Hussey said he "abruptly" told them to "please leave."

"Everybody jokes about the used car salesman — they're known to chase deals and move product. So to be told to leave a dealership when you basically are ready to write a cheque for the car? I still can't get over it."

North York Chrysler did not respond to an interview request. However, according to its website, "to prevent exports and non-retail purchases, cash sales are restricted to local customers residing within eight [kilometres] of the dealership."

The best part of that story is that he ended up with a RAV4 and not a Compass...

My thoughts exactly. Salesman did him a solid by not letting him buy a Compass

+1000!

[JohnnyMac]

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/costofliving/financing-car-dealerships-cash-1.7034159

Some dealerships in Canada just don't want your cash when you're trying to buy a car.

Tammy Hussey discovered that when she took her 84-year-old father car shopping this summer. After test-driving a 2021 Jeep Compass at a Toronto dealership, John Hussey had the money in his bank account to buy it outright — but his daughter says he was told he could only drive it home if he financed it.

After spending 30 minutes trying to convince the salesperson to let her dad use his savings to buy the car, Hussey said he "abruptly" told them to "please leave."

"Everybody jokes about the used car salesman — they're known to chase deals and move product. So to be told to leave a dealership when you basically are ready to write a cheque for the car? I still can't get over it."

North York Chrysler did not respond to an interview request. However, according to its website, "to prevent exports and non-retail purchases, cash sales are restricted to local customers residing within eight [kilometres] of the dealership."

I actually ran into something similar not long ago when helping someone find a vehicle....the low price that was advertised was for "financing" only. The cash price was a few thousand more.

I suppose there's nothing stopping you from financing it then paying it off completely 48 hours later?? Unless it's not an open loan or some crazy fine print?

That's what I don't get, almost all car sale loans are open and you can just pay it off.  I think typically the dealership doesn't get their kick back until the first payment happens on the loan, so it would be longer than 48 hours, but certainly within a month and not a whole lot of interest.  Some dealers at least are up front with stating that the price they post is for financed purchase only.  The margins on some of these vehicles are incredibly low, especially if the market it turning and the car has been sitting awhile.

[HeliDriver]

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/costofliving/financing-car-dealerships-cash-1.7034159

Some dealerships in Canada just don't want your cash when you're trying to buy a car.

Tammy Hussey discovered that when she took her 84-year-old father car shopping this summer. After test-driving a 2021 Jeep Compass at a Toronto dealership, John Hussey had the money in his bank account to buy it outright — but his daughter says he was told he could only drive it home if he financed it.

After spending 30 minutes trying to convince the salesperson to let her dad use his savings to buy the car, Hussey said he "abruptly" told them to "please leave."

"Everybody jokes about the used car salesman — they're known to chase deals and move product. So to be told to leave a dealership when you basically are ready to write a cheque for the car? I still can't get over it."

North York Chrysler did not respond to an interview request. However, according to its website, "to prevent exports and non-retail purchases, cash sales are restricted to local customers residing within eight [kilometres] of the dealership."

I actually ran into something similar not long ago when helping someone find a vehicle....the low price that was advertised was for "financing" only. The cash price was a few thousand more.

I suppose there's nothing stopping you from financing it then paying it off completely 48 hours later?? Unless it's not an open loan or some crazy fine print?

That's what I don't get, almost all car sale loans are open and you can just pay it off.  I think typically the dealership doesn't get their kick back until the first payment happens on the loan, so it would be longer than 48 hours, but certainly within a month and not a whole lot of interest.  Some dealers at least are up front with stating that the price they post is for financed purchase only.  The margins on some of these vehicles are incredibly low, especially if the market it turning and the car has been sitting awhile.

I've read of people being forced by the dealership to sign an agreement stating they wouldn't pay off the loan for at least a year. Probably varies depending on the lender, but the dealer loses their kickback if the loan gets paid off too early.

[WP v3.32]

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/costofliving/financing-car-dealerships-cash-1.7034159

Some dealerships in Canada just don't want your cash when you're trying to buy a car.

Tammy Hussey discovered that when she took her 84-year-old father car shopping this summer. After test-driving a 2021 Jeep Compass at a Toronto dealership, John Hussey had the money in his bank account to buy it outright — but his daughter says he was told he could only drive it home if he financed it.

After spending 30 minutes trying to convince the salesperson to let her dad use his savings to buy the car, Hussey said he "abruptly" told them to "please leave."

"Everybody jokes about the used car salesman — they're known to chase deals and move product. So to be told to leave a dealership when you basically are ready to write a cheque for the car? I still can't get over it."

North York Chrysler did not respond to an interview request. However, according to its website, "to prevent exports and non-retail purchases, cash sales are restricted to local customers residing within eight [kilometres] of the dealership."

I actually ran into something similar not long ago when helping someone find a vehicle....the low price that was advertised was for "financing" only. The cash price was a few thousand more.

I suppose there's nothing stopping you from financing it then paying it off completely 48 hours later?? Unless it's not an open loan or some crazy fine print?

That's what I don't get, almost all car sale loans are open and you can just pay it off.  I think typically the dealership doesn't get their kick back until the first payment happens on the loan, so it would be longer than 48 hours, but certainly within a month and not a whole lot of interest.  Some dealers at least are up front with stating that the price they post is for financed purchase only.  The margins on some of these vehicles are incredibly low, especially if the market it turning and the car has been sitting awhile.

I've read of people being forced by the dealership to sign an agreement stating they wouldn't pay off the loan for at least a year. Probably varies depending on the lender, but the dealer loses their kickback if the loan gets paid off too early.

Yeah I've read that too. I think the time was 6 months.   Dealers are loosing their bargaining chips though... 

[JohnnyMac]

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/costofliving/financing-car-dealerships-cash-1.7034159

Some dealerships in Canada just don't want your cash when you're trying to buy a car.

Tammy Hussey discovered that when she took her 84-year-old father car shopping this summer. After test-driving a 2021 Jeep Compass at a Toronto dealership, John Hussey had the money in his bank account to buy it outright — but his daughter says he was told he could only drive it home if he financed it.

After spending 30 minutes trying to convince the salesperson to let her dad use his savings to buy the car, Hussey said he "abruptly" told them to "please leave."

"Everybody jokes about the used car salesman — they're known to chase deals and move product. So to be told to leave a dealership when you basically are ready to write a cheque for the car? I still can't get over it."

North York Chrysler did not respond to an interview request. However, according to its website, "to prevent exports and non-retail purchases, cash sales are restricted to local customers residing within eight [kilometres] of the dealership."

I actually ran into something similar not long ago when helping someone find a vehicle....the low price that was advertised was for "financing" only. The cash price was a few thousand more.

I suppose there's nothing stopping you from financing it then paying it off completely 48 hours later?? Unless it's not an open loan or some crazy fine print?

That's what I don't get, almost all car sale loans are open and you can just pay it off.  I think typically the dealership doesn't get their kick back until the first payment happens on the loan, so it would be longer than 48 hours, but certainly within a month and not a whole lot of interest.  Some dealers at least are up front with stating that the price they post is for financed purchase only.  The margins on some of these vehicles are incredibly low, especially if the market it turning and the car has been sitting awhile.

I've read of people being forced by the dealership to sign an agreement stating they wouldn't pay off the loan for at least a year. Probably varies depending on the lender, but the dealer loses their kickback if the loan gets paid off too early.

Then that by definition is not an "open" car loan.  If the dealership holds the right to penalize a buyer if they do not finance for X number of days/weeks/months/years.

[Arthur Dent]

I think the "open" rules vary by province a bit.

[JohnnyMac]

I think the "open" rules vary by province a bit.

Open in this context means you can pay as much as you want, when ever you want, on the loan with no penalties.  It's the same definition everywhere, if you have a cap on any of that or if there are penalties for making extra payments, then by definition it's not "open".

[OliverD]

I think the "open" rules vary by province a bit.

Open in this context means you can pay as much as you want, when ever you want, on the loan with no penalties.  It's the same definition everywhere, if you have a cap on any of that or if there are penalties for making extra payments, then by definition it's not "open".

I think the loan is still technically "open" from the perspective of the lander. Whatever agreement you have with the dealer is a separate issue.

[JohnnyMac]

I think the "open" rules vary by province a bit.

Open in this context means you can pay as much as you want, when ever you want, on the loan with no penalties.  It's the same definition everywhere, if you have a cap on any of that or if there are penalties for making extra payments, then by definition it's not "open".

I think the loan is still technically "open" from the perspective of the lander. Whatever agreement you have with the dealer is a separate issue.

So let's say that it's open and that the dealer makes you sign a waiver stating you don't pay it off before X time period, then you go pay it off.  The dealer can charge you a feel to recoup their kickback from the finance company, but how much are they willing to fight for it?  Are they willing to go to court to enforce that?  The reality is they likely won't as it's only a few hundred bucks and that doesn't take long to accrue when you start talking about including lawyers. 

[HeliDriver]

I think the "open" rules vary by province a bit.

Open in this context means you can pay as much as you want, when ever you want, on the loan with no penalties.  It's the same definition everywhere, if you have a cap on any of that or if there are penalties for making extra payments, then by definition it's not "open".

I think the loan is still technically "open" from the perspective of the lander. Whatever agreement you have with the dealer is a separate issue.

Yes, exactly.

[sailor723]

I think the "open" rules vary by province a bit.

Open in this context means you can pay as much as you want, when ever you want, on the loan with no penalties.  It's the same definition everywhere, if you have a cap on any of that or if there are penalties for making extra payments, then by definition it's not "open".

I think the loan is still technically "open" from the perspective of the lander. Whatever agreement you have with the dealer is a separate issue.

So let's say that it's open and that the dealer makes you sign a waiver stating you don't pay it off before X time period, then you go pay it off.  The dealer can charge you a feel to recoup their kickback from the finance company, but how much are they willing to fight for it?  Are they willing to go to court to enforce that?  The reality is they likely won't as it's only a few hundred bucks and that doesn't take long to accrue when you start talking about including lawyers.

^This.  My first reaction would be to tell the dealer " off!  Sue me."  Other than maybe a lawyer's letter I seriously doubt they would try and take it very far.