Topic: 2022 F-150 Lightning

[Layne]

Well oil companies are lying to you when they claim that litre of gas is worth $2,

They're not, our elected government officials are by apply taxes (both on the consumption and production ends) that intentionally raise the cost of gas as an effort to reduce consumption. Until we elect officials who share the public's desire for affordable, market based, fuel pricing (ha!) expect the price to only continue to increase....and don't blame the oil companies for it.

Totally agree. 

We've had this conversation before, but a working middle class family with three kids to shuffle around is unlikely, in the short term, to have the financial capacity to buy a new Sienna Hybrid or PHEV SUV.  Using taxes to incentivize behaviour is all fine and dandy when the behaviour is a choice (ie, smoking, and I know that's not a perfect example).  But penalizing families that are already stretched to the max for behaviour (driving a few thousand km a month) that is completely out of their control makes no sense to me.  FFS

They should be living within their means and bike more often than drive…

Wait till gas is $3/L - it’s incoming…


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Pretty sure the family driving a miled-out ICE minivan is already living within their means....therefore unable to absorb either $3L gas OR pay for a PHEV/EV 3-row.

Unfortunately this kind of family will have to adjust - having a car will be a luxury that they may not be able to afford anymore.

That is really the plan - middle class shouldn’t be driving expensive cars, you can have a tiny hatchback and be happy with it.


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Not all of us live in an urban centre with access to timely and reliable public transit.

Yeah that will be a problem for you; but unfortunately you have to pay for your carbon - you drive more, you pay more…you will/might have to choose between a few things and decide what’s priority - house, food, fancy car…


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LMAO.

What cult do you belong to again?

It’s not a cult - it’s the reality we are being faced with. Unless major changes happen at the federal level, we are headed straight down this path - no questions asked…!

Some of you thought $2 gas was not possible…and here we are!


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And we have also had $140 barrel of crude oil.  And $30 soon after. 

[valuator]

Well oil companies are lying to you when they claim that litre of gas is worth $2,

They're not, our elected government officials are by apply taxes (both on the consumption and production ends) that intentionally raise the cost of gas as an effort to reduce consumption. Until we elect officials who share the public's desire for affordable, market based, fuel pricing (ha!) expect the price to only continue to increase....and don't blame the oil companies for it.

Totally agree. 

We've had this conversation before, but a working middle class family with three kids to shuffle around is unlikely, in the short term, to have the financial capacity to buy a new Sienna Hybrid or PHEV SUV.  Using taxes to incentivize behaviour is all fine and dandy when the behaviour is a choice (ie, smoking, and I know that's not a perfect example).  But penalizing families that are already stretched to the max for behaviour (driving a few thousand km a month) that is completely out of their control makes no sense to me.  FFS

They should be living within their means and bike more often than drive…

Wait till gas is $3/L - it’s incoming…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Pretty sure the family driving a miled-out ICE minivan is already living within their means....therefore unable to absorb either $3L gas OR pay for a PHEV/EV 3-row.

Unfortunately this kind of family will have to adjust - having a car will be a luxury that they may not be able to afford anymore.

That is really the plan - middle class shouldn’t be driving expensive cars, you can have a tiny hatchback and be happy with it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not all of us live in an urban centre with access to timely and reliable public transit.

Yeah that will be a problem for you; but unfortunately you have to pay for your carbon - you drive more, you pay more…you will/might have to choose between a few things and decide what’s priority - house, food, fancy car…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Good advice.  I'll make sure to tell my lower-middle class friends who live in a old starter home and live paycheque to paycheque and drive 100% out of necessity to (a) stop eating or (b) get in line at the food bank.

[Great_Big_Abyss]

Well oil companies are lying to you when they claim that litre of gas is worth $2,

They're not, our elected government officials are by apply taxes (both on the consumption and production ends) that intentionally raise the cost of gas as an effort to reduce consumption. Until we elect officials who share the public's desire for affordable, market based, fuel pricing (ha!) expect the price to only continue to increase....and don't blame the oil companies for it.

Totally agree. 

We've had this conversation before, but a working middle class family with three kids to shuffle around is unlikely, in the short term, to have the financial capacity to buy a new Sienna Hybrid or PHEV SUV.  Using taxes to incentivize behaviour is all fine and dandy when the behaviour is a choice (ie, smoking, and I know that's not a perfect example).  But penalizing families that are already stretched to the max for behaviour (driving a few thousand km a month) that is completely out of their control makes no sense to me.  FFS

They should be living within their means and bike more often than drive…

Wait till gas is $3/L - it’s incoming…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Pretty sure the family driving a miled-out ICE minivan is already living within their means....therefore unable to absorb either $3L gas OR pay for a PHEV/EV 3-row.

Unfortunately this kind of family will have to adjust - having a car will be a luxury that they may not be able to afford anymore.

That is really the plan - middle class shouldn’t be driving expensive cars, you can have a tiny hatchback and be happy with it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not all of us live in an urban centre with access to timely and reliable public transit.

Yeah that will be a problem for you; but unfortunately you have to pay for your carbon - you drive more, you pay more…you will/might have to choose between a few things and decide what’s priority - house, food, fancy car…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Good advice.  I'll make sure to tell my lower-middle class friends who live in a old starter home and live paycheque to paycheque and drive 100% out of necessity to (a) stop eating or (b) get in line at the food bank.

Yeah, even if $2/L or $3/L gasoline comes back, an expensive EV will NOT be the answer for people like your friends (and myself - I'm in that class).  Cheaper but modern 4-cylinder CUV's or 4-cyl cars are the answer here.  Still relatively good on gas, cheap to maintain, and far, far cheaper to buy and more readily available than an EV. 

EV's are still playthings for the moderately wealthy at this point.  They aren't practical alternatives to cheap 4-bangers yet, despite Tauri's delusions. 

I'm willing to bet that even after 10 years of driving, the overall cost of ownership of my CX-5 will be cheaper than Tauri's Lightning. 

[tpl]

Wait till gas is $3/L - it’s incoming…

It's quite possible when CAD is worth 45 cents USD.  Canadians with their own wood lot are going to be in heaven.

Come now Artic...what makes you think the (Liberal/NDP) government will allow people to burn wood?

[tpl]

Well oil companies are lying to you when they claim that litre of gas is worth $2,

They're not, our elected government officials are by apply taxes (both on the consumption and production ends) that intentionally raise the cost of gas as an effort to reduce consumption. Until we elect officials who share the public's desire for affordable, market based, fuel pricing (ha!) expect the price to only continue to increase....and don't blame the oil companies for it.

Totally agree. 

We've had this conversation before, but a working middle class family with three kids to shuffle around is unlikely, in the short term, to have the financial capacity to buy a new Sienna Hybrid or PHEV SUV.  Using taxes to incentivize behaviour is all fine and dandy when the behaviour is a choice (ie, smoking, and I know that's not a perfect example).  But penalizing families that are already stretched to the max for behaviour (driving a few thousand km a month) that is completely out of their control makes no sense to me.  FFS

They should be living within their means and bike more often than drive…

Wait till gas is $3/L - it’s incoming…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Pretty sure the family driving a miled-out ICE minivan is already living within their means....therefore unable to absorb either $3L gas OR pay for a PHEV/EV 3-row.

Unfortunately this kind of family will have to adjust - having a car will be a luxury that they may not be able to afford anymore.

That is really the plan - middle class shouldn’t be driving expensive cars, you can have a tiny hatchback and be happy with it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not all of us live in an urban centre with access to timely and reliable public transit.

Yeah that will be a problem for you; but unfortunately you have to pay for your carbon - you drive more, you pay more…you will/might have to choose between a few things and decide what’s priority - house, food, fancy car…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

LMAO.

What cult do you belong to again?

It’s not a cult - it’s the reality we are being faced with. Unless major changes happen at the federal level, we are headed straight down this path - no questions asked…!

Some of you thought $2 gas was not possible…and here we are!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think that we will get a rather different government. Even a lot of Liberal and NDP voters will see the light before much longer.  After all Canada has enough gas and oil to last at least a century or two by ignoring the greenies.   If we start being really silly with the environment  then  we could end up being annexed by the USA....they may get another crazy person as president  sooner or later.   

[EV-Light]

Well oil companies are lying to you when they claim that litre of gas is worth $2,

They're not, our elected government officials are by apply taxes (both on the consumption and production ends) that intentionally raise the cost of gas as an effort to reduce consumption. Until we elect officials who share the public's desire for affordable, market based, fuel pricing (ha!) expect the price to only continue to increase....and don't blame the oil companies for it.

Totally agree. 

We've had this conversation before, but a working middle class family with three kids to shuffle around is unlikely, in the short term, to have the financial capacity to buy a new Sienna Hybrid or PHEV SUV.  Using taxes to incentivize behaviour is all fine and dandy when the behaviour is a choice (ie, smoking, and I know that's not a perfect example).  But penalizing families that are already stretched to the max for behaviour (driving a few thousand km a month) that is completely out of their control makes no sense to me.  FFS

They should be living within their means and bike more often than drive…

Wait till gas is $3/L - it’s incoming…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Pretty sure the family driving a miled-out ICE minivan is already living within their means....therefore unable to absorb either $3L gas OR pay for a PHEV/EV 3-row.

Unfortunately this kind of family will have to adjust - having a car will be a luxury that they may not be able to afford anymore.

That is really the plan - middle class shouldn’t be driving expensive cars, you can have a tiny hatchback and be happy with it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not all of us live in an urban centre with access to timely and reliable public transit.

Yeah that will be a problem for you; but unfortunately you have to pay for your carbon - you drive more, you pay more…you will/might have to choose between a few things and decide what’s priority - house, food, fancy car…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Good advice.  I'll make sure to tell my lower-middle class friends who live in a old starter home and live paycheque to paycheque and drive 100% out of necessity to (a) stop eating or (b) get in line at the food bank.

Yeah, even if $2/L or $3/L gasoline comes back, an expensive EV will NOT be the answer for people like your friends (and myself - I'm in that class).  Cheaper but modern 4-cylinder CUV's or 4-cyl cars are the answer here.  Still relatively good on gas, cheap to maintain, and far, far cheaper to buy and more readily available than an EV. 

EV's are still playthings for the moderately wealthy at this point.  They aren't practical alternatives to cheap 4-bangers yet, despite Tauri's delusions. 

I'm willing to bet that even after 10 years of driving, the overall cost of ownership of my CX-5 will be cheaper than Tauri's Lightning.

Hard to beat my ROI, specially with ultra cheap hydro…drove 13k kms so far for a total of $348…that’s nothing lol specially because I get the carbon tax rebate…I literally spent $0 so far driving.


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[rrocket]

Well oil companies are lying to you when they claim that litre of gas is worth $2,

They're not, our elected government officials are by apply taxes (both on the consumption and production ends) that intentionally raise the cost of gas as an effort to reduce consumption. Until we elect officials who share the public's desire for affordable, market based, fuel pricing (ha!) expect the price to only continue to increase....and don't blame the oil companies for it.

Totally agree. 

We've had this conversation before, but a working middle class family with three kids to shuffle around is unlikely, in the short term, to have the financial capacity to buy a new Sienna Hybrid or PHEV SUV.  Using taxes to incentivize behaviour is all fine and dandy when the behaviour is a choice (ie, smoking, and I know that's not a perfect example).  But penalizing families that are already stretched to the max for behaviour (driving a few thousand km a month) that is completely out of their control makes no sense to me.  FFS

They should be living within their means and bike more often than drive…

Wait till gas is $3/L - it’s incoming…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Pretty sure the family driving a miled-out ICE minivan is already living within their means....therefore unable to absorb either $3L gas OR pay for a PHEV/EV 3-row.

Unfortunately this kind of family will have to adjust - having a car will be a luxury that they may not be able to afford anymore.

That is really the plan - middle class shouldn’t be driving expensive cars, you can have a tiny hatchback and be happy with it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not all of us live in an urban centre with access to timely and reliable public transit.

Yeah that will be a problem for you; but unfortunately you have to pay for your carbon - you drive more, you pay more…you will/might have to choose between a few things and decide what’s priority - house, food, fancy car…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Good advice.  I'll make sure to tell my lower-middle class friends who live in a old starter home and live paycheque to paycheque and drive 100% out of necessity to (a) stop eating or (b) get in line at the food bank.

Yeah, even if $2/L or $3/L gasoline comes back, an expensive EV will NOT be the answer for people like your friends (and myself - I'm in that class).  Cheaper but modern 4-cylinder CUV's or 4-cyl cars are the answer here.  Still relatively good on gas, cheap to maintain, and far, far cheaper to buy and more readily available than an EV. 

EV's are still playthings for the moderately wealthy at this point.  They aren't practical alternatives to cheap 4-bangers yet, despite Tauri's delusions. 

I'm willing to bet that even after 10 years of driving, the overall cost of ownership of my CX-5 will be cheaper than Tauri's Lightning.

Hard to beat my ROI, specially with ultra cheap hydro…drove 13k kms so far for a total of $348…that’s nothing lol specially because I get the carbon tax rebate…I literally spent $0 so far driving.


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With that type of low mileage, it will take forever to recoup ROI considering these aren't exactly a cheap initial purchase

In the US, it appears to be 10 years.

https://chargedevs.com/newswire/pickup-truck-lovers-compare-tco-of-the-ford-f-150-lightning-with-the-legacy-gas-version/

[Great_Big_Abyss]

^^^ Not with Tauri-Math it won't.

[Fobroader]

Wow, so if I buy a Ford F-oneshitty, Turdashian is going to pay me to drive it?!?!?! Sweet!! I'll go get one of the many just sitting on the lot of any dealer around here, wonder why people aren't clamoring to get their claws into the basically pay you to drive it vehicles!??!?. Maybe you should tell everyone that this "truck", that can't tow or handle cold weather, will pay you to drive it.

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[Hannibalsmith]

Wow, so if I buy a Ford F-oneshitty, Turdashian is going to pay me to drive it?!?!?! Sweet!! I'll go get one of the many just sitting on the lot of any dealer around here, wonder why people aren't clamoring to get their claws into the basically pay you to drive it vehicles!??!?. Maybe you should tell everyone that this "truck", that can't tow or handle cold weather, will pay you to drive it.

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Lol...although strictly looking at his particular case, it's probably true. If he was early to buy it, the truck has appreciated. And as he noted little costs to drive it.

[Great_Big_Abyss]

I still don't like the idea of using the carbon tax rebate to offset his electrical usage in the Lightning.  EVERYONE in Manitoba gets that carbon tax rebate.  I get the same carbon tax rebate he does. 

If I were to use the same rationalization and use the carbon tax rebate to offset the cost of putting gas in my car, I could argue that I went from a fuel economy of 10L/100km to only using 5L/100km. 
It's the same argument, and not at all true. 

Like I said, funky math. 

[valuator]

I still don't like the idea of using the carbon tax rebate to offset his electrical usage in the Lightning.  EVERYONE in Manitoba gets that carbon tax rebate.  I get the same carbon tax rebate he does. 

If I were to use the same rationalization and use the carbon tax rebate to offset the cost of putting gas in my car, I could argue that I went from a fuel economy of 10L/100km to only using 5L/100km. 
It's the same argument, and not at all true. 

Like I said, funky math.

That is an excellent point.

[EV-Light]

I still don't like the idea of using the carbon tax rebate to offset his electrical usage in the Lightning.  EVERYONE in Manitoba gets that carbon tax rebate.  I get the same carbon tax rebate he does. 

If I were to use the same rationalization and use the carbon tax rebate to offset the cost of putting gas in my car, I could argue that I went from a fuel economy of 10L/100km to only using 5L/100km. 
It's the same argument, and not at all true. 

Like I said, funky math.

Not really funky math at all…everyone in MB gets it. You can use it to reduce your carbon costs, like you do because that’s tackled on the gas, heating, everything you buy or you can help people with EVs in MB drive for free…hydro doesn’t have carbon associated to it, at least not in MB.

I’m happy for that !! Keep buying gas cars folks lol

My personal opinion? Carbon tax has to go, costs are too high for the average family (read the updated PBO report) and we are not even near full implementation…but it is what it is.


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[Guy]

Well I finally drove my BIL Lightning yesterday and have to say I was mightily impressed. Very good ride and this thing accelerates even stronger than my Mach-E. The independent rear suspension puts it in a totally different league than other pickups. Very well executed vehicle.

[EV-Light]

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[ArticSteve]

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Oh just stop it man.  You are a parts guy at a Winnipeg Ford Store.

[ArticSteve]

Well I finally drove my BIL Lightning yesterday and have to say I was mightily impressed. Very good ride and this thing accelerates even stronger than my Mach-E. The independent rear suspension puts it in a totally different league than other pickups. Very well executed vehicle.

I'm sure it accelerates fantastically for 30 minutes between charges.

I own 2 Fords so I'm routing for them, but I don't think they will survive the "EV" transition.  Their long term debt is rolling over and killing them. Definitely should have declared bankruptcy like GM and let the American taxpayer pay it down.

They've chopped "Mustang" EV production by 50% because they are losing substantial cash on each unit.  The "Lightening" will be the same story.  It gets 50% of Ford's purported range @ 32F.  It's a disaster.  Plus they have mega UAW issues.  It would be terrible to see Ford tank. GM's balance sheet is so much stronger.  Not a good story.

 

[Layne]

Well I finally drove my BIL Lightning yesterday and have to say I was mightily impressed. Very good ride and this thing accelerates even stronger than my Mach-E. The independent rear suspension puts it in a totally different league than other pickups. Very well executed vehicle.

How’s it do as a…. You know… truck?  As opposed to a party trick.

[ArticSteve]

From the CBC; interviewing a an idiot who decided to take a battery F150 from Blunderbay to Halifax and ran out for juice shortly thereafter.  Last time I went thru Wawa I was lucky to get gas. 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/thunder-bay/ev-charger-outtages-northern-ontario-1.6895863 

[OliverD]

From the CBC; interviewing a an idiot who decided to take a battery F150 from Blunderbay to Halifax and ran out for juice shortly thereafter.  Last time I went thru Wawa I was lucky to get gas. 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/thunder-bay/ev-charger-outtages-northern-ontario-1.6895863

Yeah, having chargers along a route means nothing if they aren't reliable.