Topic: Preview: 2020 Toyota Supra

[Jaeger]

Ass end of this thing rivals the Type R for fugliness. 

I think the back looks great, that snout on the other hand...

The back is my favorite part. Looks awesome and distinctive.

Well you think the Type R looks great - so no surprise you like this thing!    And I'd say both of those cars are pretty... um.... distinctive.     I'm not doing cartwheels over the front end of the Supra either, but yikes the back is a hot mess. Oh well - I'm glad manufacturers are still building sporty coupes at all, even if I don't love this one.

[rrocket]

Ass end of this thing rivals the Type R for fugliness. 

I think the back looks great, that snout on the other hand...

The back is my favorite part. Looks awesome and distinctive.

Well you think the Type R looks great - so no surprise you like this thing!    And I'd say both of those cars are pretty... um.... distinctive.     I'm not doing cartwheels over the front end of the Supra either, but yikes the back is a hot mess. Oh well - I'm glad manufacturers are still building sporty coupes at all, even if I don't love this one.

Wow! You're in the minority. The vast majority of people on the forums, writers, etc love the back.

I think more people are complaining about the front!

[quadzilla]

I love that ass!

[KD]

I agree it looks great.  Like a modern version of the clown shoe Zs.  Big negative for me is lack of a manual tranny.

[CanuckS2K]

The Canadian versions will have/be the premium options/trim and will be $80K plus.  Huge disappointment.  Should have called it something else.

Did I miss this press release?

Sent from my SM-T230NU using Tapatalk

FWIW, the $68K the Supra sold for in Canada in 1994 would equate to $105K today....

Except that the Supra back then was well above normal in terms of HP comparitive to most cars then.  Now, you can get a family sedan pushing 300hp.  Obviously not saying HP is everything, but I would of expected more is all.  Love the looks of it though, but like Tom mentioned sucks there is no manual tranny option.  But that doesn't surprise me either.   

[Jaeger]

Maybe I'll like it better in the metal.    But then I said the same about the CTR aaaaand nope!

[Jaeger]

I love that ass!

It looks better in that view - because you are seeing a flat plane, and can't tell how far all the wacky different ass bits stick out differently with respect to one another.  Kind of like a badly overloaded diaper bulging every which way.



But hey - people like what they like!

[quadzilla]

It looks better in that view - because you are seeing a flat plane, and can't tell how far all the wacky different ass bits stick out differently with respect to one another:

But hey - people like what they like!

I like wacky though. Bug eye WRX, yep. RC F, yep. GTR, yep.

[Jaeger]

It looks better in that view - because you are seeing a flat plane, and can't tell how far all the wacky different ass bits stick out differently with respect to one another:

But hey - people like what they like!

I like wacky though. Bug eye WRX, yep. RC F, yep. GTR, yep.

Then you have found your ride!  I do kind of like the double-bubble roof, though.

[Great_Big_Abyss]

So, I'm a little confused as to why Toyota partnered with BMW on this one.

Toyota, as one of the largest (the largest?!?) automobile manufacturers in the world has arguably the largest R&D budget of any carmaker.  They also have lots of experience building sports cars, both under the Toyota brand in the 90's, and then the Lexus brand in the 2000's.  So it's not like they don't have prior experience, nor the budget to develop their own sportscar. 

The Supra is a halo car for Toyota, therefore wouldn't it have been beneficial for Toyota to develop ALL the technology that went into it, as a sort of showcase of what they can do? 

I dunno.  It just seems like by going with a platform and drivetrain developed by BMW, they're just kinda half-assing it on this one. 

[rrocket]

So, I'm a little confused as to why Toyota partnered with BMW on this one.

Toyota, as one of the largest (the largest?!?) automobile manufacturers in the world has arguably the largest R&D budget of any carmaker.  They also have lots of experience building sports cars, both under the Toyota brand in the 90's, and then the Lexus brand in the 2000's.  So it's not like they don't have prior experience, nor the budget to develop their own sportscar. 

The Supra is a halo car for Toyota, therefore wouldn't it have been beneficial for Toyota to develop ALL the technology that went into it, as a sort of showcase of what they can do? 

I dunno.  It just seems like by going with a platform and drivetrain developed by BMW, they're just kinda half-assing it on this one.

I've reflected on this quite a bit.  I'm guessing it comes down to engine and powertrain.  It would have been prohibitively expensive for them to design the I6 required for a Supra....and engine that has no other practical use across the line.  These days, designing an engine from scratch can cost up to a billion dollars...a sum that would never be recouped via a Supra.

It's also a very Japanese thing to partner with competitors...this is known as "kereitsu" in Japan.  It's entirely possible this thinking is, somewhat, part of the reasoning...but now partnering with someone outside of Japan to ultimately reach a goal.  I have not read this angle...but just wonder if that's part of it too.

[ArticSteve]

I dunno.  It just seems like by going with a platform and drivetrain developed by BMW, they're just kinda half-assing it on this one.

^^   That's why I said they should have called it something else.  And I will stick to my projection that Canada will only receive the loaded models and they will be $80K in Ontario.  Something to see on Motoring TV for 10 minutes and then it will be forgotten.

[dougjp]

I think Toyota is hedging its bets on this, and minimizing costs. Not only the BMW mechanical bits, but it will be built in Austria by Magna alongside the Z4. They get a halo car, an image changer, but if it isn't wildly successful sales wise, not a big problem.

Toyota may have the R&D budget and the $$, but they are stingy when they want to be, which is often. For example using old tooling like continuing with rear drum brakes on volume models many years after everyone else gave up on them.

In a business sense, they are usually very smart. I always thought they were crazy getting into NASCAB racing, using a reworked truck motor in a tube frame race car made to look like goober's family transportation Camry. But there they are, accurately assessing the IQ of the American (and Cdn) buyer!   

[rrocket]

This isn't as much a partnership as it was just altering a Z4 and calling it a Supra. Slightly disappointing regardless of the justifications.

They didn't just alter a Z4 though.  There was no Z4 (yet) at the time Toyota got the chassis.  Personally, I don't think they look anything alike.

Now if you mean you're disappointed with sharing components, then ya, I get you.  But both cars we designed separately.

BMW design boss Adrian van Hooydonk said that the two cars were designed separately. (This mirrors what Toyota design chief says)

“The design teams went their separate ways and I never saw what they did until we were finished. We had a meeting at the end where we shared with one another what we’d done, on the same wheelbase and mechanicals.”

Hooydonk acknowledges it’s easy to spot that the car’s visuals were designed separately: “They look very different. Our design languages are still intact; we didn’t have to make a compromise and neither did they. We each have a strong idea about how we want to develop our brand, and Toyota’s is different from BMW’s. The cars fulfill slightly different roles for each of us.”

[CanuckS2K]

I dunno.  It just seems like by going with a platform and drivetrain developed by BMW, they're just kinda half-assing it on this one.

^^   That's why I said they should have called it something else.  And I will stick to my projection that Canada will only receive the loaded models and they will be $80K in Ontario.  Something to see on Motoring TV for 10 minutes and then it will be forgotten.

That's the only thing that bothers me with this car is that it's basically a Z4. Yes, I know there are some changes but man even that interior is pure BMW. For a SUPRA I wanted something a little more pure Japanese not a rebadged Z4. I still like it but that's the one thing that bothers me.

This isn't as much a partnership as it was just altering a Z4 and calling it a Supra. Slightly disappointing regardless of the justifications.

100% agree.  I was really wanting/expecting the new Supra to be something special and different.  I've honestly never been a huge fan of BMW interiors, so the Supra sharing a lot of the parts bin so to speak doesn't impress me a whole lot.  Count me as one of those that is confused why Toyota would parter with BMW to reincarnate their halo car, especially with their impressive record in the past of building amazing sports cars. 

[Weels]

The Supra certainly intrigues me, but i still think i'd be putting my monthly payment on a Cayman...

[Great_Big_Abyss]

I wonder if BMW fans on their forums are saying "Ugh, I don't want a rebadged Toyota as a Z4" 

[rrocket]

Just seeing this now....

https://jalopnik.com/here-s-where-toyota-and-bmw-parted-ways-on-the-new-supr-1831780403?utm_source=recirculation&utm_medium=recirculation&utm_campaign=tuesdayPM

[KD]

I'm just happy someone is still making true sports cars these days.  They really are a dying breed, at the affordable level anyways.   Needs a manual though...can't state that enough...lol

[CSH]

Another important question to ask is that will the engine in this supra gain the legendary status of thr 2JZ. Can it get 700+hp reliably.