Topic: Test Ride: 2018 Kawasaki Ninja 400

[Gurgie]

Meh, guess it's a fun little bike & all, but I'm sure the parallel twin would get tiring for me in the long run. Was never a fan of them, maybe they've improved, but a small displacement inline 4 that sings to the moon is huge gobs of fun, like the old Suzuki GS-400, it put down 48.7hp to the rear tire 38yrs ago 

The GS400 didn't sing to the moon.

You're confusing it with the GSF400 (Bandit 400) which did sing to the moon.

And yes...people are largely clueless about how amazing the 400s (and 250s) from the 90s were. Even now, they are so far ahead from what's on offer now it almost a joke.

Yes, sorry the GSF-400 Bandit, we used to just call it a Bandit 400. I rode a couple of them & boy were they great little bikes that just loved to rev! Light as well. Just think of  putting that motor into a more modern & lighter frame & components, what a facking hoot that would be!

I don't know why they gave up on small displacement 4's? Emissions? Manufacturing costs?

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Cost. For example, in the 90s, the 400s were the most advanced, highest tech bikes in the Japanese lineups. They had aluminum frames and banana swing arms when the 600s didn't. Due to JDM regulations, 400cc was basically the biggest bike in Japan...so they got all the love from the manufacturers.

They were...and still are...very special bikes.

I'll have to ask my buddy what ever became of his Bandit 400... I know it was just sitting for a while after he got his cruiser, but then I can't remember if ever sold it, or what became of it.

[johngenx]

Yeah, I'd have a hard time paying over $8K for a 400cc bike when I can get something like an FZ for not much more.

Those Suzy Bandits were sweet bikes.  They actually looked pretty good too.

[dkaz]

Oh I like naked. There's a teeny weenie bikini fairing for the Duke that (somehow) makes a huge difference. I'd not have believed it until I tried it.

Here it is fitted to a 2017

Oh that front end looks sexy.

You like those naked European models.

[dirtyjeffer]

no doubt the Ninja 400 is a solid overall bike...i just wish Kawasak Canada brought this colour over...it's effin gorgeous (the USA has it):

[rrocket]

Oh I like naked. There's a teeny weenie bikini fairing for the Duke that (somehow) makes a huge difference. I'd not have believed it until I tried it.

Here it is fitted to a 2017

Oh that front end looks sexy.

You like those naked European models.

I gotta tell ya...I'm only lukewarm for the new 790 Duke...even though all reports suggest it's awesome..

[dirtyjeffer]

Yeah, I'd have a hard time paying over $8K for a 400cc bike when I can get something like an FZ for not much more.

agreed, but the Honda CB400F bikes are still made (in Japan) and i would LOVE to have one...amazing bikes...the last one i rode (late 80s) is still one of my favourite bikes to this day.

they are called the CB400F Super Four (plus, it's got Vtec yo).



it would make most of the 400s we see here currently look like toys...it's not a cheap small cc bike.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VkJeA33i5Y

[dirtyjeffer]

It was scratched off early on my list because of lack of incentives, and I don't blame them -- why would they?

it looks like they have 3.99% finance for 60 months and 5.99% for 72 months...not a bad deal on a relatively lower cost bike ($6200).

[DriverJeff]

Meh, guess it's a fun little bike & all, but I'm sure the parallel twin would get tiring for me in the long run. Was never a fan of them, maybe they've improved, but a small displacement inline 4 that sings to the moon is huge gobs of fun, like the old Suzuki GS-400, it put down 48.7hp to the rear tire 38yrs ago 

Honda has an inline-4 CBR 400R overseas that makes ~46 HP. Problem is it'd be over $8k here and while there'd be some sales for people who want a light weight bike that sounds great and makes excellent power, most people will disagree with the ~$1000 premium over the CBR 500R and go with that instead

Depends what you want. The KTM is still the better sportbike. The Ninja arguably the better all arounder.

I still favor the KTM. Shorter wheelbase (by an inch! ) bigger brakes, better dash (IMO), more character in the engine, throttle by wire, slightly better suspension, adjustable levers, etc. Lots of little details.

Can't go wrong with either though.

Yea the video I posted said it basically boiled down to wanting a good all round bike vs. a sport bike.

And I think the Duke makes it the better all rounder than the RC390. Better ergos for the street. I much prefer it to the RC. Another thing that the Duke is that isn't mentioned often in reviews...it feels so tiny. You literally see nothing in front of you. No fairing, no nothing. Just the road ahead.

Rumor has it the Ninja is coming over with a naked 400!

I've heard that 'rumour' too.  Z400. 

[DriverJeff]

Oh I like naked. There's a teeny weenie bikini fairing for the Duke that (somehow) makes a huge difference. I'd not have believed it until I tried it.

Here it is fitted to a 2017

Oh that front end looks sexy.

You like those naked European models.

I gotta tell ya...I'm only lukewarm for the new 790 Duke...even though all reports suggest it's awesome..

Why not?!

[rrocket]

The styling isn't as sharp as the 390 or 1290 IMO. And despite the 790 sounding more like a V than a parallel...I'm just not a fan of parallels.

There is no question that the 790 is incredible...and by all accounts is the best handling bike in class.

[dirtyjeffer]

Meh, guess it's a fun little bike & all, but I'm sure the parallel twin would get tiring for me in the long run. Was never a fan of them, maybe they've improved, but a small displacement inline 4 that sings to the moon is huge gobs of fun, like the old Suzuki GS-400, it put down 48.7hp to the rear tire 38yrs ago 

Honda has an inline-4 CBR 400R overseas that makes ~46 HP. Problem is it'd be over $8k here and while there'd be some sales for people who want a light weight bike that sounds great and makes excellent power, most people will disagree with the ~$1000 premium over the CBR 500R and go with that instead

Depends what you want. The KTM is still the better sportbike. The Ninja arguably the better all arounder.

I still favor the KTM. Shorter wheelbase (by an inch! ) bigger brakes, better dash (IMO), more character in the engine, throttle by wire, slightly better suspension, adjustable levers, etc. Lots of little details.

Can't go wrong with either though.

Yea the video I posted said it basically boiled down to wanting a good all round bike vs. a sport bike.

And I think the Duke makes it the better all rounder than the RC390. Better ergos for the street. I much prefer it to the RC. Another thing that the Duke is that isn't mentioned often in reviews...it feels so tiny. You literally see nothing in front of you. No fairing, no nothing. Just the road ahead.

Rumor has it the Ninja is coming over with a naked 400!

I've heard that 'rumour' too.  Z400.

likely no rumour...Kawasaki has already filed documents with CARB to certify it...it may not be called a Z400 as it was internally referred to as "ER400DK", but in any case, it's looks like it's coming (at least, to the US).

http://canadamotoguide.com/2018/08/24/rumour-kawasaki-z400-is-about-to-debut/

as a side note, i was browsing the website above, and noticed Jacob Black writes articles in there too.   

[rrocket]

Yeah, I'd have a hard time paying over $8K for a 400cc bike when I can get something like an FZ for not much more.

agreed, but the Honda CB400F bikes are still made (in Japan) and i would LOVE to have one...amazing bikes...the last one i rode (late 80s) is still one of my favourite bikes to this day.

they are called the CB400F Super Four (plus, it's got Vtec yo).



it would make most of the 400s we see here currently look like toys...it's not a cheap small cc bike.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VkJeA33i5Y

it would make most of the 400s we see here currently look like toys...it's not a cheap small cc bike.

Yep...these would make a mockery of them too.



Honda CB-1,
https://www.kijiji.ca/v-moto-sport-promenade/ville-de-montreal/honda-cb-1/1362186998?utm_source=com.google.android.apps.docs&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=socialbuttons&utm_content=app_android





1989 Yamaha FZR400,
https://www.kijiji.ca/v-sport-bikes/kitchener-waterloo/1989-yamaha-fzr400/1380954322?utm_source=com.google.android.apps.docs&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=socialbuttons&utm_content=app_android

[johngenx]

The Honda 400cc upright twin "Hawk" of the early 80s was a giant slayer not because of power, but because of light weight and a really great chassis.  I never owned one, but got to wring them out on twisty roads and really enjoyed them.  I still preferred the larger cc bikes, but I figured that the 400-500 class would lose the twins and get great inline fours and become an awesome segment.  That sort of happened here, but not to the extent I thought it would.  Then the 600 sport bike class exploded and that was the spotlight segment for many years.

[dirtyjeffer]

The Honda 400cc upright twin "Hawk" of the early 80s was a giant slayer not because of power, but because of light weight and a really great chassis.  I never owned one, but got to wring them out on twisty roads and really enjoyed them.  I still preferred the larger cc bikes, but I figured that the 400-500 class would lose the twins and get great inline fours and become an awesome segment.  That sort of happened here, but not to the extent I thought it would.  Then the 600 sport bike class exploded and that was the spotlight segment for many years.

parallel twins won only due to cost...it's my guess that it's the only reason why we don't have the current gen CB400F here...they are still very popular elsewhere where their sold, but they don't buy bikes by the pound or cc there.

[Bubba]

Uh, I want to get a bike like this so much, but the insurance here in Manitoba is prohibitive...Manitoba is possibly the worst place in the country to insure a bike...

That may change since MPI's new CEO rides motorcycles.

[DriverJeff]

Meh, guess it's a fun little bike & all, but I'm sure the parallel twin would get tiring for me in the long run. Was never a fan of them, maybe they've improved, but a small displacement inline 4 that sings to the moon is huge gobs of fun, like the old Suzuki GS-400, it put down 48.7hp to the rear tire 38yrs ago 

Honda has an inline-4 CBR 400R overseas that makes ~46 HP. Problem is it'd be over $8k here and while there'd be some sales for people who want a light weight bike that sounds great and makes excellent power, most people will disagree with the ~$1000 premium over the CBR 500R and go with that instead

Depends what you want. The KTM is still the better sportbike. The Ninja arguably the better all arounder.

I still favor the KTM. Shorter wheelbase (by an inch! ) bigger brakes, better dash (IMO), more character in the engine, throttle by wire, slightly better suspension, adjustable levers, etc. Lots of little details.

Can't go wrong with either though.

Yea the video I posted said it basically boiled down to wanting a good all round bike vs. a sport bike.

And I think the Duke makes it the better all rounder than the RC390. Better ergos for the street. I much prefer it to the RC. Another thing that the Duke is that isn't mentioned often in reviews...it feels so tiny. You literally see nothing in front of you. No fairing, no nothing. Just the road ahead.

Rumor has it the Ninja is coming over with a naked 400!

I've heard that 'rumour' too.  Z400.

likely no rumour...Kawasaki has already filed documents with CARB to certify it...it may not be called a Z400 as it was internally referred to as "ER400DK", but in any case, it's looks like it's coming (at least, to the US).

http://canadamotoguide.com/2018/08/24/rumour-kawasaki-z400-is-about-to-debut/

as a side note, i was browsing the website above, and noticed Jacob Black writes articles in there too.   

Ya don't say?  It's almost as if AutoTrader were the parent of Canada Moto Guide or something?    I heard some Jeff-guy hack also writes there...         (see Kawi Ninja400 story that started this thread).... 

[DriverJeff]

The styling isn't as sharp as the 390 or 1290 IMO. And despite the 790 sounding more like a V than a parallel...I'm just not a fan of parallels.

There is no question that the 790 is incredible...and by all accounts is the best handling bike in class.

Yeah, I hear ya on the parallel twin front.  I'eve never met one yet that felt right to me... but I'm willing to give the 790 the benefit of the doubt until I ride it. 

[rrocket]

The styling isn't as sharp as the 390 or 1290 IMO. And despite the 790 sounding more like a V than a parallel...I'm just not a fan of parallels.

There is no question that the 790 is incredible...and by all accounts is the best handling bike in class.

Yeah, I hear ya on the parallel twin front.  I'eve never met one yet that felt right to me... but I'm willing to give the 790 the benefit of the doubt until I ride it.

I THINK we'd probably like this one. Probably. It's very unique what they've done here. They wanted to use a V-twin (as with their other bikes), but since their goal was ultimate compactness, the V wouldn't work. So they went parallel. But they wanted the sound and pulses of a V. So they built a "big bang" engine.

The crank pins are offset 75 degrees and the firing order is 435 degrees.

It's quite interesting.

[rrocket]

Maybe a dumb question but how different is the riding experience of the 400 and 650 since they aren't that far apart price wise?
Is the 650 more of a cruiser or similar to the 400 with a bit more oompf?

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Similar...but more power.

Though some (me) prefer the lighter weight and handling of the smaller bikes....

[dkaz]

Maybe a dumb question but how different is the riding experience of the 400 and 650 since they aren't that far apart price wise?
Is the 650 more of a cruiser or similar to the 400 with a bit more oompf?

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The 400 would be more suitable for new riders who have completed a riding course. I don't see riding schools jumping to equip a ~45 HP bike for absolute first time riders but once riders have had experience with 8 to 25 HP bikes in the parking lot, a 45 HP bike should feel good. A ~70 HP bike is significantly more power and would be akin to giving a new driver a Focus ST, GTI, etc. as a beginner car. A 100 HP+ bike like a 600cc or 1000cc super sport is like giving a new driver a Hellcat, Lambo, etc. Some riders will justify this by saying "just learn to control the throttle and you'll be fine.

The 400 is also super light weight and is forgiving, make it a great bike to learn to track, yet has limits few riders ever reach before they think they're ready to go up a bike size. mlin32 is one of the few, see his posts.

The 650 bike is kind of a do all bike, good enough at all things. If one could afford a 400 AND a 1000, that'd be ideal, but if not, a 650 is good. Good enough for track days, good enough for long distance riding, good enough for day to day riding. Let's say it's the Honda Accord of motorcycles. Parallel to to the 650 are the 600s which are damn good at track days, and well, that's about it. It's a dying class with people preferring the 1000s. Let's call these the STI/Type R/RS of riding, if those cars could do 0-60 in 3 seconds.

Now with 1000s, there are two types of 1000s. 1000 sports which produce maybe 140 HP but gobs of torque, is more designed for day to day comfort than out right speed, then 1000 super sports which produce north of 200 HP and are track beasts. 0-60 is still just under 3 seconds so that's not where they excel against the 600s, where they excel is having that raw power to hit north of 300 km/h.

I'm sure some of that information could be better but in a nut shell.

Though some (me) prefer the lighter weight and handling of the smaller bikes....

This.