Topic: Right of Way

[blotter]

I could most likely "look it up" but I thought it may be a good topic to debate.

here's a scene that played out this morning:

There's a car coming from a side street and arrives to make a full stop at a two lane 80km limit rural road.
Signal on to turn right and head West.

there are no cars heading West and the road is clear for the car to turn right.

There is a transport truck heading East and slows down (you couldn't really tell if he was turning into a farm or stopping on the shoulder)   

Being the car is turning right and the road is clear, the car pulls out.

As the car pulls out, the truck has come to a complete stop in the lane (not shoulder or pulling in somewhere)  Meanwhile there's another truck coming Eastbound and as the car moves fulling Westbound, this upcoming truck NOW turns on a signal and decides he's going to make a pass.

The car who is now fully on the road heading westbound manages the accellarate and clear the scene just as the truck goes to make the pass.

-----

I've seen this scene play out a few times since working out here (rural drive vs urban) and I'm curious who would be at fault here?

Does the car need to ensure BOTH sides are clear before pulling, just in case someone else decides to make a pass?    Or in this case is the second truck at fault as he can only pull out.

Both vehicles made their move at the same time so i'm not 100% sure who would be really at fault.

?

[wing]

Guy in his lane (assuming he is in the lane when he gets smoked) is in the right.  Guy that pulled out and is now no longer in his lane is at fault.

[Black Hatch]

Guy in his lane (assuming he is in the lane when he gets smoked) is in the right.  Guy that pulled out and is now no longer in his lane is at fault.

Yup. You can be right but do you want to be "dead" right?
As this is an rural setting I probably wait until ALL vehicles pass before pulling onto the highway.

[wing]

Yeah I am paranoid that way, rarely do I pull out onto the road with traffic in either direction, but especially if traffic flow is light.  I can wait 5 seconds.

[Snowman]

You are dead right. I have been in similar situations before and the last one was when I pulled out to pass a car and another driver comes out of a side road and turns right and into me, clearly he never looked both ways. I  had to brake hard and he bailed to the shoulder to avoid the collision.

[Northernridge]

Living in the country this is one the scariest scenarios for me when my kids started driving.

[blotter]

country driving certainly seems to have it's "own laws"

while I usually make sure both sides are clear coming off the side streets, I've noticed when I'm on the main road, that many cars (actually pick up trucks  ) coming onto the main road don't bother stopping!!!

To them it's might as well be a yield sign!


the scenario above, from my vantage point (behind the car that went).  It looked like the truck that went to pass didn't move into the oncoming lane for his pass until after the car went. (both making a move at the same time)   It was one of those, "oh sh*t, here we go" moments

[tooscoops]

whenever i'm passing, i'm checking ahead for sideroads or people waiting to turn... likewise, when i'm pulling out, i'm looking at what's going on, not just if it's clear right then. like, if in your situation it was a train of 4 cars bumper to bumper, i wouldn't make my turn because i would assume someone is wanting to pass...

in the original scenario, you'd be "not at fault" i would assume until it got to a point of contributory negligence to find out just how much people might think you'd be to blame... definitely more the trucks fault though as mentioned. he owes a duty of care to other motorists and a reasonable person would assume vehicles to be driving in their designated lanes.

[Black Hatch]

Why would anyone pass at an intersection?  Unless I'm absolutely certain the person in front of me is turning right, I'll wait, even if there is no traffic (most around here don't know where their blinkers are anyway so you better wait).

Because people don't want to wait.
Someone ahead is turning, they go into the other lane to pass.

Or maybe they drive too fast.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyUSLCe3S58

[blotter]

So I talked to some of my co-workers about what I had seen.
they're all local.   They told me the road is famous for this time of stuff. 
There's multiple accidents annually, some of them head on from scenes like the one above that didn't turn out so well.   

[evil_twin]

Why would anyone pass at an intersection?  Unless I'm absolutely certain the person in front of me is turning right, I'll wait, even if there is no traffic (most around here don't know where their blinkers are anyway so you better wait).

This.

Never pass if there is an intersection ahead.   Even if you know the truck is turning right.  In fact, I've seen situations where a car is waiting on the OTHER side of the intersection (on the road the truck is looking to turn right on to), waiting to turn left, and decides to make his/her left turn b/c the truck is stopping/stopped and "blocking" the flow of traffic in the oncoming lane.   You can be passing in this situation and smash head on in to them as they round left in front of the truck.

All scary situations, and not worth the 5 second time savings.

[Black Hatch]

Why would anyone pass at an intersection?  Unless I'm absolutely certain the person in front of me is turning right, I'll wait, even if there is no traffic (most around here don't know where their blinkers are anyway so you better wait).

This.

Never pass if there is an intersection ahead.   Even if you know the truck is turning right.  In fact, I've seen situations where a car is waiting on the OTHER side of the intersection (on the road the truck is looking to turn right on to), waiting to turn left, and decides to make his/her left turn b/c the truck is stopping/stopped and "blocking" the flow of traffic in the oncoming lane.   You can be passing in this situation and smash head on in to them as they round left in front of the truck.

All scary situations, and not worth the 5 second time savings.

It's not a matter of YOU not passing another at the intersection.
It's a matter of the OTHER guy not obeying the rules and passing and colliding into you.

Somewhat defensive driving and awareness.

[evil_twin]

Why would anyone pass at an intersection?  Unless I'm absolutely certain the person in front of me is turning right, I'll wait, even if there is no traffic (most around here don't know where their blinkers are anyway so you better wait).

This.

Never pass if there is an intersection ahead.   Even if you know the truck is turning right.  In fact, I've seen situations where a car is waiting on the OTHER side of the intersection (on the road the truck is looking to turn right on to), waiting to turn left, and decides to make his/her left turn b/c the truck is stopping/stopped and "blocking" the flow of traffic in the oncoming lane.   You can be passing in this situation and smash head on in to them as they round left in front of the truck.

All scary situations, and not worth the 5 second time savings.

It's not a matter of YOU not passing another at the intersection.
It's a matter of the OTHER guy not obeying the rules and passing and colliding into you.

Somewhat defensive driving and awareness.

Oh I fully agree. 

But some previous posters were mentioning scary incidents when they were the one doing the passing near a sideroad, driveway, or intersection and had to make an emergency manuevre.

[Snowman]

Why would anyone pass at an intersection?  Unless I'm absolutely certain the person in front of me is turning right, I'll wait, even if there is no traffic (most around here don't know where their blinkers are anyway so you better wait).

This.

Never pass if there is an intersection ahead.   Even if you know the truck is turning right.  In fact, I've seen situations where a car is waiting on the OTHER side of the intersection (on the road the truck is looking to turn right on to), waiting to turn left, and decides to make his/her left turn b/c the truck is stopping/stopped and "blocking" the flow of traffic in the oncoming lane.   You can be passing in this situation and smash head on in to them as they round left in front of the truck.

All scary situations, and not worth the 5 second time savings.

It's not a matter of YOU not passing another at the intersection.
It's a matter of the OTHER guy not obeying the rules and passing and colliding into you.

Somewhat defensive driving and awareness.

Oh I fully agree. 

But some previous posters were mentioning scary incidents when they were the one doing the passing near a sideroad, driveway, or intersection and had to make an emergency manuevre.

  On northern rural highways that run through heavily forested areas it is impossible to see all side roods. The incident I described a truck pulled out onto the road turning right without stopping to look right while I was in the middle of passing. On the prairies or open rural farming areas that should not be an issue.