Topic: New vs Newer: 2018 vs 2019 Hyundai Santa Fe

[Great_Big_Abyss]

I think you guys are all mistaking Turbo Lag and Boost Threshold.

Boost Threshold is the RPM at which the turbo 'comes on'.  On all these modern turbo engines, the boost threshold is set pretty low.  1400rpm, or so.  On Gurgie's 951, the boost threshold was set higher, at around 3000 rpm.  A lot of 'old school' turbo engines like the old WRX, the STI, etc. have higher boost thresholds. 

That still doesn't change the fact that all turbo engines have a little bit of lag.  Lag is the delay between opening the throttle to get full power, and the engine building up enough exhaust gases to spin up the turbo, and then the turbo building up enough pressure in the intake tract to create boost.  Every turbo engine will have a bit of lag.  It is better now than it used to be for a number of reasons:  turbos are mounted closer to the engine so the exhaust and intake plumbing is shorter, and modern turbos are typically itty-bitty therefore they have low inertia and don't take much effort to spin up to speed.

They still have lag, though, especially compared to a naturally aspirated engine, which makes full power at a given RPM as soon as you open the throttle. 

[Gurgie]

I think you guys are all mistaking Turbo Lag and Boost Threshold.

Boost Threshold is the RPM at which the turbo 'comes on'.  On all these modern turbo engines, the boost threshold is set pretty low.  1400rpm, or so.  On Gurgie's 951, the boost threshold was set higher, at around 3000 rpm.  A lot of 'old school' turbo engines like the old WRX, the STI, etc. have higher boost thresholds. 

That still doesn't change the fact that all turbo engines have a little bit of lag.  Lag is the delay between opening the throttle to get full power, and the engine building up enough exhaust gases to spin up the turbo, and then the turbo building up enough pressure in the intake tract to create boost.  Every turbo engine will have a bit of lag.  It is better now than it used to be for a number of reasons:  turbos are mounted closer to the engine so the exhaust and intake plumbing is shorter, and modern turbos are typically itty-bitty therefore they have low inertia and don't take much effort to spin up to speed.

They still have lag, though, especially compared to a naturally aspirated engine, which makes full power at a given RPM as soon as you open the throttle.

The newer turbos are smaller as well, and a lot of them are twin scroll, so they spool up quicker, providing the boost earlier. Older turbos were larger and took more exhaust gas pressure to spool up and provide power. While a turbo 4 might have lag off the line for the 1st 20' compared to a V6 over that 1st 20', it will make up for it much quicker when it hits that ~1500rpm level... the V6 won't have full torque until somewhere around 3500rpms.

[Great_Big_Abyss]

I think you guys are all mistaking Turbo Lag and Boost Threshold.

Boost Threshold is the RPM at which the turbo 'comes on'.  On all these modern turbo engines, the boost threshold is set pretty low.  1400rpm, or so.  On Gurgie's 951, the boost threshold was set higher, at around 3000 rpm.  A lot of 'old school' turbo engines like the old WRX, the STI, etc. have higher boost thresholds. 

That still doesn't change the fact that all turbo engines have a little bit of lag.  Lag is the delay between opening the throttle to get full power, and the engine building up enough exhaust gases to spin up the turbo, and then the turbo building up enough pressure in the intake tract to create boost.  Every turbo engine will have a bit of lag.  It is better now than it used to be for a number of reasons:  turbos are mounted closer to the engine so the exhaust and intake plumbing is shorter, and modern turbos are typically itty-bitty therefore they have low inertia and don't take much effort to spin up to speed.

They still have lag, though, especially compared to a naturally aspirated engine, which makes full power at a given RPM as soon as you open the throttle.

The newer turbos are smaller as well, and a lot of them are twin scroll, so they spool up quicker, providing the boost earlier. Older turbos were larger and took more exhaust gas pressure to spool up and provide power. While a turbo 4 might have lag off the line for the 1st 20' compared to a V6 over that 1st 20', it will make up for it much quicker when it hits that ~1500rpm level... the V6 won't have full torque until somewhere around 3500rpms.

^^Yes, that is true.  I just wanted people to realize that what they are talking about is a function of boost threshold, not turbo lag.  There is a difference between the two.

[Niklasky]

I think it looks good, there's not much lacking in this new Hyundai offering except... well it lacks a bit of personality, it is as bland as plain yogurt.

[Great_Big_Abyss]

I think it looks good, there's not much lacking in this new Hyundai offering except... well it lacks a bit of personality, it is as bland as plain yogurt.

^^Isn't that the case for most manufacturer's mainstream offerings, though?

[tortoise]

I dunno.

The CX-5 looks the great.  And the CR-V and Rav are anything but bland.

[Niklasky]

The exterior isn't bad, it's mostly the interior that is pretty drab. I think the competition does better inside, especially Mazda and Toyota.