Topic: THE DAY HAS COME! Transport Canada considering less stringent bumper rules!

[The Mighty Duck]

  Why should TC lower standards for the 2 or 3 models that manufactures who did not put sufficient engineering effort to comply?

Standardization between America and Canada reduces costs and increases model availability in Canada.  Canada is a small market, so there is very little incentive for many companies to produce models that conform to our standards in order to sell their cars here.  It also reduces costs because manufactures do not have to engineer two different machines, and then build two different machines for the US and Canadian market.

That's in theory, though.  In reality, most US cars we also get, with a few exceptions.  And I'm assuming most US cars are built to Canadian specifications anyway, since most are on the RIV acceptable list.

I'm interested to know why you're such a fan of the government acting to keep car costs for Canadians high, Snowy.  You're against the Gov't doing anything that would reduce our standards and thus make the importation of new cars easier, which equates to higher prices.  Why?

[Snowman]

Did I mention that out of the hundreds of models sold in North America we are talking about three models that failed to meet the standard? What unit costs are we achieving here $500? This will give the insurance industry in Canada a reason to raise the rates to compensate for the increase in repairs.

[tpl]

Did I mention that out of the hundreds of models sold in North America we are talking about three models that failed to meet the standard? What unit costs are we achieving here $500? This will give the insurance industry in Canada a reason to raise the rates to compensate for the increase in repairs.

I think that we are ALSO talking about a non-tariff barrier for manufacturers in general. Now granted that Alfa-Romeo, Fiat etc would not suddenly say "WOW! we can sell to Canada now" if our bumper standards were relaxed but it might just help a little if TC were to get into a mode of permitting rather than forbidding... maybe they'd permit something else... like kit cars for instance

If we want the Insurance companies to charge us less then maybe we should lobby for the ICBC system to be used in Ontario and get rid of them altogether.  ( Although the Ins Co's would scream I don't think they can sue a province under NAFTA only the Feds)

[turbodiesel]

  Why should TC lower standards for the 2 or 3 models that manufactures who did not put sufficient engineering effort to comply?

Standardization between America and Canada reduces costs and increases model availability in Canada.  Canada is a small market, so there is very little incentive for many companies to produce models that conform to our standards in order to sell their cars here.  It also reduces costs because manufactures do not have to engineer two different machines, and then build two different machines for the US and Canadian market.

That's in theory, though.  In reality, most US cars we also get, with a few exceptions.  And I'm assuming most US cars are built to Canadian specifications anyway, since most are on the RIV acceptable list.

I'm interested to know why you're such a fan of the government acting to keep car costs for Canadians high, Snowy.  You're against the Gov't doing anything that would reduce our standards and thus make the importation of new cars easier, which equates to higher prices.  Why?

not just that, if standardize with UNECE too, guess what? I can import E200 Kompressor, 320i, 120i... (those of "lesser" models) from Europe at ease! Don't tell me those premium cars ain't even meet 4km/h bumper rule! I've read from BMW 5-series that it can go 15km/h without damage! (marketing magic, for those who doubts it )

[Titanium48]

A much more sensible approach would be to make ALL bumpers on vehicles sold to the public and vehicles that are likely ENCOUNTERED by the public ( buses, 18 wheelers etc)  ALL the same height with a massive fine for anyone who lowers or jacks up their vehicle outside a narrow range. I realize that some people with jacked up trucks object and so do some rice boys.... too bad.

Time to go back to the bumpers that are made of something that will take a hit for a change instead of the cheap paper thin useless crap they use now. The only thing they are any good for is to look good. Nothing else at all as you hit something at creeping speed and its still over $2000. to start with. Even the bumper on my 1972 GMC is at least 25 times stronger then the junk of to-day by all of the builders. They save weight on the car but nothing else is worth the damage they cause to the owners pocket or the Insurance Comanies pockets which in turn you pay for anyways. 

How about this for a standard:  Bumpers must withstand impact at 4 km/h with no damage whatsoever.  Bumpers must withstand impact at 8 km/h with damage restricted to the cover and backing material only.  Replacement parts must be available for less than $250 and require no more than 1 hour to install.

[avtoller]

"How about this for a standard:  Bumpers must withstand impact at 4 km/h with no damage whatsoever.  Bumpers must withstand impact at 8 km/h with damage restricted to the cover and backing material only.  Replacement parts must be available for less than $250 and require no more than 1 hour to install."

Well, that would certainly isolate us from the entire rest of the world. 

[turbodiesel]

"How about this for a standard:  Bumpers must withstand impact at 4 km/h with no damage whatsoever.  Bumpers must withstand impact at 8 km/h with damage restricted to the cover and backing material only.  Replacement parts must be available for less than $250 and require no more than 1 hour to install."

Well, that would certainly isolate us from the entire rest of the world. 

yup, so it's socially unacceptable 

[Trainman]

Well, this has been a fun read   

Except for the mis-matched bumper height issue, I think the bumpers we have now are just fine.  They are part of an integrated safety system and help to deflect energy away from the occupants.  And after all, is not protection of people (occupants, pedestrians etc) what we want?  Or is it more important to be able to have a bigger selection of vehicles?  Or less cost of repairs?        I know what I want   

I would have no issue with the Saab type bumpers of 20 years ago if they did the primary job of protecting people, who cares what they look like?   

[safristi]

we NEED BOTH...Ure wants are irrelevent I'm sure yer "CHUFFED" outta yer Station..ya COAL HEARTED BASTARD.......... chuf   chuFF  CHUff   CHUFFF....woo Hoo

[Vil]

The proposed amendment would modify the Canadian safety standard for Bumpers via incorporation by reference of similar safety standards from the United States and Europe. This would have the effect of aligning the testing speeds with those of Europe and the United States and provide manufacturers the option of meeting the European safety requirements or the safety and no damage provisions of the United States.

http://canadagazette.gc.ca/par....html

[Vil]

not just that, if standardize with UNECE too, guess what? I can import E200 Kompressor, 320i, 120i... (those of "lesser" models) from Europe at ease! Don't tell me those premium cars ain't even meet 4km/h bumper rule! I've read from BMW 5-series that it can go 15km/h without damage! (marketing magic, for those who doubts it )

There are many Canadian standards that are not harmonized with the EU.  So even if the bumper standard was to be harmonized with the EU, it won't mean you can import an EU vehicle that is less than 15 years old.

[tpl]

Vil please don't paste partial links.   http://canadagazette.gc.ca/par....html     is not well formed and doesn't work..probably because at the moment the stuff you are referring to is part of a larger page. The thing is half way down this.   http://canadagazette.gc.ca/partI/2007/20071013/html/notice-e.html

[Triple Bob]

Just out of curiosity, has the current bumper regulations resulted in a much reduced level of injury/fatalities since it was introduced?

[safristi]

Probably a million more Americans died than Canadians in the last 20 years.......... ...............

[tpl]

bump.

I was just looking at the TC and RIV sites and I saw no mention that this change had been implemented.  Although in the RIV document I saw that for some Porsches they actually give the part numbers of the bits required to make the bumpers meet Cdn standards in the list of vehicles.   Amazing.